2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

I'm pretty sure it was by accident
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1101 by jester » Wed May 27, 2020 8:32 am

Hovercraft wrote:Betman said training camps wont start until July 1 so USA might be good enough to play in empty arenas then.

Wonder what every team's injury situation is? Patrick is certainly interesting but I wonder if any players started getting surgeries or anything assuming season was over. Especially on those 10-12th place teams.


They all knew this was getting negotiated, so it shouldn't be a surprise. That said, this whole mess does screw up the recovery period between seasons. Smart players may have got something minor taken care of quickly. That said, elective surgeries got halted in a lot of places.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1102 by Rogers Pancreas » Wed May 27, 2020 11:21 am

jester wrote:So, interesting question: if Nolan Patrick is ready to go, do they put him out there?

Nolan Patrick as a third or fourth line option would be a luxury and a half, but his conditioning has to be so far behind the curve I can't see it happening.

The draft format for this year is so NHL. It's so needlessly complicated, it's impossible to become too invested. Great job all-around, guys.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1103 by jester » Wed May 27, 2020 11:58 am

Rogers Pancreas wrote:
jester wrote:So, interesting question: if Nolan Patrick is ready to go, do they put him out there?

Nolan Patrick as a third or fourth line option would be a luxury and a half, but his conditioning has to be so far behind the curve I can't see it happening.

The draft format for this year is so NHL. It's so needlessly complicated, it's impossible to become too invested. Great job all-around, guys.


But, here's the thing: The season getting paused for two months makes Patrick FAR MORE viable an option than he would have been had the halt not happened -- all of these guys are going to be at significant conditioning deficits compared to normal stretch drive/playoff fitness levels. And if this all goes according to plan, we're talking July at the earliest. That being said, you're going to go from 0-120mph in this format real quick. So, it's interesting ... if he was "close" to coming back prior to the shutdown (hard to tell, honestly), then he's probably more likely to be ready now? Right?

Are people at a non-niche level in the US ever invested in the draft?
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1104 by Rogers Pancreas » Wed May 27, 2020 1:50 pm

Outside of when an American team is projected to select first overall? No.

Point made.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1105 by jester » Wed May 27, 2020 2:40 pm

Rogers Pancreas wrote:Outside of when an American team is projected to select first overall? No.

Point made.


They aren't even that interested then. NHL draft is never going to be a big deal (in the US) because even invested fans don't know the players.

Same is true of MLB.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1106 by CantSeeColors » Wed May 27, 2020 3:06 pm

jester wrote:
Rogers Pancreas wrote:
jester wrote:So, interesting question: if Nolan Patrick is ready to go, do they put him out there?

Nolan Patrick as a third or fourth line option would be a luxury and a half, but his conditioning has to be so far behind the curve I can't see it happening.

The draft format for this year is so NHL. It's so needlessly complicated, it's impossible to become too invested. Great job all-around, guys.


But, here's the thing: The season getting paused for two months makes Patrick FAR MORE viable an option than he would have been had the halt not happened -- all of these guys are going to be at significant conditioning deficits compared to normal stretch drive/playoff fitness levels. And if this all goes according to plan, we're talking July at the earliest. That being said, you're going to go from 0-120mph in this format real quick. So, it's interesting ... if he was "close" to coming back prior to the shutdown (hard to tell, honestly), then he's probably more likely to be ready now? Right?

Are people at a non-niche level in the US ever invested in the draft?

If Patrick is 100% healthy on the migraine front, he's too talented to leave out. Even if his conditioning is behind, give me 8 good minutes a night.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1107 by jester » Wed May 27, 2020 4:03 pm

CantSeeColors wrote:
jester wrote:
Rogers Pancreas wrote:Nolan Patrick as a third or fourth line option would be a luxury and a half, but his conditioning has to be so far behind the curve I can't see it happening.

The draft format for this year is so NHL. It's so needlessly complicated, it's impossible to become too invested. Great job all-around, guys.


But, here's the thing: The season getting paused for two months makes Patrick FAR MORE viable an option than he would have been had the halt not happened -- all of these guys are going to be at significant conditioning deficits compared to normal stretch drive/playoff fitness levels. And if this all goes according to plan, we're talking July at the earliest. That being said, you're going to go from 0-120mph in this format real quick. So, it's interesting ... if he was "close" to coming back prior to the shutdown (hard to tell, honestly), then he's probably more likely to be ready now? Right?

Are people at a non-niche level in the US ever invested in the draft?

If Patrick is 100% healthy on the migraine front, he's too talented to leave out. Even if his conditioning is behind, give me 8 good minutes a night.


I tend to be lean this direction, and also think the time off made this more of a possibility. I think the larger question would be whether an extra few months off before a full season would benefit him to get back to 100% on a permanent basis? Of course, who knows what the next season is going to look like ... or when it will start.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1108 by chaosof99 » Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:17 pm

I was bored at work and after watching a bunch of Sportsnet videos on trade trees I made my own:

Image

Edit: I missed that Kimmo was actually traded for a 2nd and a 4th, the 4th of which upgraded to a 2nd and is in the graphic. The other 2nd was used to jump ahead in the 2015 draft to get Travis Konecny.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1109 by DeadPhish » Wed Jun 17, 2020 9:14 am

Finally a Flyer wins a major award!

Image
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1110 by jester » Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:41 am

I think Couturier is getting the Selke this year.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1111 by CantSeeColors » Wed Jun 17, 2020 12:36 pm

jester wrote:I think Couturier is getting the Selke this year.

Which pales in comparison to "best beard."
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1112 by jester » Wed Jun 17, 2020 1:15 pm

CantSeeColors wrote:
jester wrote:I think Couturier is getting the Selke this year.

Which pales in comparison to "best beard."


I mean, he smokes everyone with best smile, too. #stuffofnightmares
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1113 by JLHockeyKnight » Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:50 pm

Arguably the most pertinent Flyers news of the year:

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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1114 by Boring Choice #2 » Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:53 pm

Is he coming out of the closet? Because the logo makes it appear that way.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1115 by JLHockeyKnight » Tue Jun 23, 2020 8:54 pm

Oh you.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1116 by jester » Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:46 am

Yeah, this seems like shockingly good news. Hopefully everything is cleared up soon for him to really get back to whatever "normal" is these days.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1117 by CantSeeColors » Mon Jul 13, 2020 11:16 am

Uh, is Patrick really not on the return-to-play roster? Yikes.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1118 by jester » Mon Jul 13, 2020 11:55 am

CantSeeColors wrote:Uh, is Patrick really not on the return-to-play roster? Yikes.


It's a bummer, but it might also just be a collective risk-averse decision given how completely messed up all of this is. I mean, I think chances are against them actually finishing this "season" without having to shut down again, but lets hope for the best -- being in Canada as opposed to Florida will help.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1119 by chicpea » Mon Jul 13, 2020 12:25 pm

I have to say, after my habs (lifelong) and Canucks (hometown), the Flyers are the team I root for lately. Good luck to all of you and your families.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1120 by CantSeeColors » Mon Jul 13, 2020 1:40 pm

jester wrote:
CantSeeColors wrote:Uh, is Patrick really not on the return-to-play roster? Yikes.


It's a bummer, but it might also just be a collective risk-averse decision given how completely messed up all of this is. I mean, I think chances are against them actually finishing this "season" without having to shut down again, but lets hope for the best -- being in Canada as opposed to Florida will help.

I'm sure that's all true, but if migraines are still not under control, that doesn't bode well for his long-term outlook.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1121 by jester » Mon Jul 13, 2020 2:32 pm

CantSeeColors wrote:
jester wrote:
CantSeeColors wrote:Uh, is Patrick really not on the return-to-play roster? Yikes.


It's a bummer, but it might also just be a collective risk-averse decision given how completely messed up all of this is. I mean, I think chances are against them actually finishing this "season" without having to shut down again, but lets hope for the best -- being in Canada as opposed to Florida will help.

I'm sure that's all true, but if migraines are still not under control, that doesn't bode well for his long-term outlook.


Hard to judge from the cheap seats. They said in the presser today that Patrick self reports as having never felt better since when this all started. And given how little we knew about his status previously, that has to be taken as good news given that he seemed to be improving based on the objective clues we had (e.g., starting to skate more with the team, etc.). Obviously, the ideal scenario would have been him showing up ready to go. But I'm not sure this precludes him being a good bet for next season (whenever that starts) and long term beyond that.

It's a tough position for Fletcher, as there is every reason to believe Patrick was going to be a good (potentially very good) player for a long time. Do you really want to risk that for however this is going to play out? Especially if another few months will help him stabilize the migraines and so forth, whereas a concussion might be a major setback?
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1122 by Hovercraft » Mon Jul 13, 2020 4:08 pm

Ghost had another minor knee surgery too
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1123 by CantSeeColors » Tue Jul 14, 2020 11:14 am

jester wrote:
CantSeeColors wrote:
jester wrote:
It's a bummer, but it might also just be a collective risk-averse decision given how completely messed up all of this is. I mean, I think chances are against them actually finishing this "season" without having to shut down again, but lets hope for the best -- being in Canada as opposed to Florida will help.

I'm sure that's all true, but if migraines are still not under control, that doesn't bode well for his long-term outlook.


Hard to judge from the cheap seats. They said in the presser today that Patrick self reports as having never felt better since when this all started. And given how little we knew about his status previously, that has to be taken as good news given that he seemed to be improving based on the objective clues we had (e.g., starting to skate more with the team, etc.). Obviously, the ideal scenario would have been him showing up ready to go. But I'm not sure this precludes him being a good bet for next season (whenever that starts) and long term beyond that.

It's a tough position for Fletcher, as there is every reason to believe Patrick was going to be a good (potentially very good) player for a long time. Do you really want to risk that for however this is going to play out? Especially if another few months will help him stabilize the migraines and so forth, whereas a concussion might be a major setback?

Agree with all that, I'm just pessimistic on the long-term outlook if it takes this long to respond. Of course, Crosby dealt with upwards of 2 years of concussions, then got over them and has never looked back, so who knows?
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1124 by jester » Tue Jul 14, 2020 1:30 pm

CantSeeColors wrote:Agree with all that, I'm just pessimistic on the long-term outlook if it takes this long to respond. Of course, Crosby dealt with upwards of 2 years of concussions, then got over them and has never looked back, so who knows?


Well, right, nothing about this is ideal. And there's no way Patrick is going to get the long-term extension, etc. that he might have been in line for at this point. But it really seemed like they were moving towards him possibly getting in some games towards the end there -- possibly doing a lot of work. This didn't seem to be trending in a Savard direction or anything like that (yet).
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1125 by CantSeeColors » Wed Jul 15, 2020 1:29 pm

jester wrote:
CantSeeColors wrote:Agree with all that, I'm just pessimistic on the long-term outlook if it takes this long to respond. Of course, Crosby dealt with upwards of 2 years of concussions, then got over them and has never looked back, so who knows?


Well, right, nothing about this is ideal. And there's no way Patrick is going to get the long-term extension, etc. that he might have been in line for at this point. But it really seemed like they were moving towards him possibly getting in some games towards the end there -- possibly doing a lot of work. This didn't seem to be trending in a Savard direction or anything like that (yet).

I'm not sure if that makes it better or worse, to be honest. It's been four additional months since then. Maybe COVID shutdowns prevented him from getting the medical advice/treatment he needed to keep progressing? This is all wild speculation, and I hope I'm wrong, I just don't feel optimistic about nearly any injury if the recovery is this slow.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1126 by jester » Wed Jul 15, 2020 2:33 pm

CantSeeColors wrote:I'm not sure if that makes it better or worse, to be honest. It's been four additional months since then. Maybe COVID shutdowns prevented him from getting the medical advice/treatment he needed to keep progressing? This is all wild speculation, and I hope I'm wrong, I just don't feel optimistic about nearly any injury if the recovery is this slow.


So, I kind of agree. I remember a chat a while back about maybe all of this would make it more likely he could come back and contribute "this" season. That said, at the time I assumed they would play some sort of remaining slate of regular season games before going into the playoffs. I also assumed that COVID would be under a bit more control at this stage -- the NHL trying to do this in Canada may be the strongest factor that will let them complete a season.

That said, I think there's good reason for the Flyers to be very cautious with Patrick in the current situation. He hasn't played in over a year, and they are going almost immediately into "playoff" games -- have they even announced how many exhibition games they might play? There is also the very real chance this whole scheme crashes and burns with a quickness if COVID gets among the players. In short, all of this may be a waste of time. Given those two variables, I could easily see a collective decision just getting made to scratch the season for Patrick and hope he's good and ready to go whenever the next season starts.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1127 by Rogers Pancreas » Thu Jul 16, 2020 6:38 pm

So, the Flyers made "the playoffs", AV is a Jack Adams finalist, Oskar is cancer free and a Masterton Memorial finalist, and Couturier should be a Selke finalist.

All things considered, not a bad year overall.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1128 by jester » Thu Jul 16, 2020 11:16 pm

Rogers Pancreas wrote:So, the Flyers made "the playoffs", AV is a Jack Adams finalist, Oskar is cancer free and a Masterton Memorial finalist, and Couturier should be a Selke finalist.

All things considered, not a bad year overall.


If Couturier doesn't win the Selke it's a goddamn crime.

I hope to God we get to have a real season following this mess, because we're right on the cusp of being a real good team.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1129 by Rogers Pancreas » Fri Jul 17, 2020 12:24 pm

Richards I always felt was an elite two-way player, in his prime. He could play defense at a high level, and produce offensively at a high level. But he was never a true shutdown forward. Crosby, Malkin, Ovechkin and the like always managed to get their points when they played (the Flyers). Couturier, though, is The Real Deal. It doesn't matter who you match him up against, that player is going to have a tough time scoring, and the metrics support it.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1130 by Rogers Pancreas » Fri Jul 17, 2020 10:07 pm

So, fun facts...

Bernie Parent, our undisputed goaltending canon in Flyers' history, only played for the organization from the age of 22 to 33. And he lost 2.5 seasons to shit I didn't bother to research. Just know that he wasn't there. It wasn't his choice, I'm sure, but it's something working against him.

Parent came into the league with Boston at 20 yrs old, just like Hart did (only with Philadelphia). But what's interesting is their win totals and their GSAA. Bernie had 16 wins through 2 years. Hart has 40. Bernie had 32 losses. Hart has just 26. Bernie had a -7.34 and -8.84 GSAA. Hart has a 6.97 and 4.47 GSAA. (Bernie also had an ungodly 72.65 GSAA in '73 to his credit, which Hart will likely never match, but the point I'm trying to make is that the kid has a jump start on Bernie's Flyer career.)

Noe, it's s going to be tough for Carter to match the peak performance of Parent, Lindbergh, and to a lesser extent Hextall. But if he takes care of himself, and he doesn't price himself out the way runningbacks in the NFL are doing these days, Carter could overtake Bernie in just about every statistical category conceivable (Flyers history only).

If I'm not mistaken, the same can be said for Provorov with respect to Howe, too.

Crazy times.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1131 by CantSeeColors » Sun Jul 19, 2020 3:27 pm

It’s going to be a bit of a mind trip when Hart is #3 on the franchise wins list in like two years
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1132 by Rogers Pancreas » Mon Jul 20, 2020 3:10 pm

Well, it's official. Couturier is now a two-time Selke finalist. This should he his year, though.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1133 by vonbonds » Wed Jul 22, 2020 12:31 pm

Rogers Pancreas wrote:So, the Flyers made "the playoffs", AV is a Jack Adams finalist, Oskar is cancer free and a Masterton Memorial finalist, and Couturier should be a Selke finalist.

All things considered, not a bad year overall.

I never care about awards other than the actual Stanley Cup, that said I really hope Oskar gets the Masterton. Any and all good emotions should be sent his way by the league to help him keep up a great spirit which I believe means more than is measurable to fighting cancer.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1134 by jester » Wed Jul 22, 2020 12:57 pm

So, Couturier's wife is in labor ... and he's about to head to the bubble. That's fucking rough.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1135 by jester » Wed Jul 22, 2020 1:18 pm

Lindblom for 3 @3M hit is potential robbery if he makes a full recovery. Good deal for both sides, too.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1136 by JLHockeyKnight » Wed Jul 22, 2020 3:37 pm

jester wrote:So, Couturier's wife is in labor ... and he's about to head to the bubble. That's fucking rough.


I mean, sure it sucks. They planned for an offseason baby. COVID hit after she already became pregnant.

Add it to the list of things COVID has fucked up.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1137 by CantSeeColors » Wed Jul 22, 2020 3:53 pm

jester wrote:Lindblom for 3 @3M hit is potential robbery if he makes a full recovery. Good deal for both sides, too.

While it's a huge underpay if he plays like he did before the diagnosis, to be in his shoes and get an offer for a fully guaranteed $9 million before even really practicing again must feel incredible.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1138 by jester » Wed Jul 22, 2020 4:01 pm

CantSeeColors wrote:
jester wrote:Lindblom for 3 @3M hit is potential robbery if he makes a full recovery. Good deal for both sides, too.

While it's a huge underpay if he plays like he did before the diagnosis, to be in his shoes and get an offer for a fully guaranteed $9 million before even really practicing again must feel incredible.


Yep, and I assume guaranteed health insurance, etc. as well. I'm surprised they went for 3 years, but get why it is appealing to his camp.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1139 by Hovercraft » Wed Jul 22, 2020 4:15 pm

Yeah I'm really happy for Lindblom.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1140 by Rogers Pancreas » Wed Jul 22, 2020 6:09 pm

vonbonds wrote:
Rogers Pancreas wrote:So, the Flyers made "the playoffs", AV is a Jack Adams finalist, Oskar is cancer free and a Masterton Memorial finalist, and Couturier should be a Selke finalist.

All things considered, not a bad year overall.

I never care about awards other than the actual Stanley Cup, that said I really hope Oskar gets the Masterton. Any and all good emotions should be sent his way by the league to help him keep up a great spirit which I believe means more than is measurable to fighting cancer.

I never thought I did either until I reevaluated what interests me about the NHL. And it isn't really the Stanley Cup, or even winning games. It's this organization's history, which is being rewritten every single season by the likes of Giroux, Couturier, Provorov and Hart.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1141 by Rogers Pancreas » Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:31 am

It looks like Lindblom made the playoff roster.

...

There's no way they actually let him play, though. Right?
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1142 by Konecny HypeTrain Captain » Mon Jul 27, 2020 4:35 pm

If Nick Foles won the Eagles a superbowl because it was the only way the Eagles could win a superbowl. I'm convinced the only way the Flyers could actually win a cup is if somebody who just beat cancer comes back and carries them in the cup final. But realistically there is no way he plays. Can't even imagine how much weight he lost it would be an idiotic risk to play him.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1143 by jester » Mon Jul 27, 2020 6:22 pm

Konecny HypeTrain Captain wrote:If Nick Foles won the Eagles a superbowl because it was the only way the Eagles could win a superbowl. I'm convinced the only way the Flyers could actually win a cup is if somebody who just beat cancer comes back and carries them in the cup final. But realistically there is no way he plays. Can't even imagine how much weight he lost it would be an idiotic risk to play him.


I actually think I read he didn't lose much weight. But I cannot imagine he's in physical shape to play a game. Also curious if his rib cage is fully healed for contact just yet.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1144 by vonbonds » Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:11 am

It’s a helluva gesture if the club did it to keep the positive vibes going his way assuming (likely) he’s not fit to play yet. Either way I’m going to get my kid his jersey when he comes back full time.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1145 by Hovercraft » Sat Oct 03, 2020 11:09 am

Elliot re-signed, 1 year @ 1.5mil. Pretty good deal, 500k paycut for him. Hagg and NAK have new deals too. Myers and Patrick are the only key ones left now.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1146 by JLHockeyKnight » Sat Oct 03, 2020 12:27 pm

I love it. Perfectly reasonable deal for both parties assuming Hart stays healthy and plays much of what I assume will be a shortened season. And we still have Elliott to help mentor Hart.

I assume Myers gets a small pay bump and Patrick something similar as a bridge/recovery contract.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1147 by Hovercraft » Sat Oct 03, 2020 3:21 pm

Myers was making below current league minimum, he's in for a big raise. Probably similar to Sanheims deal, around 2.5mil. No idea what to do with Patrick.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1148 by jester » Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:45 pm

... Niskanen retiring it sounds like. Probably helpful cap-wise, but would have liked to get one more year from him.

This would considerably relieve pressure on moving Ghost.
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1149 by Hovercraft » Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:49 pm

Didn't expect that! Definitely makes it easy to keep ghost until expansion draft at least. Sounds like Braun re signing for 2 years at 1.8mil too.

Who do you play with Provorov now? Myers or Ghost?
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Re: 2017-18 Pertinent Philadelphia Flyers News

Post #1150 by jester » Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:51 pm

They have the cap space to potentially be aggressive now if they want -- particularly if they still move Ghost. So, stay tuned, I guess.

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