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Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:57 pm
by Dr_Chimera
I really like this post. Someone took their time. http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showp ... stcount=50

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2015 8:21 am
by PPJ
Best eligible player not in the Hall of Fame. Obviously the likes of Dick Duff and Clark Gillies were better hockey players. The Hall would never lie.

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2015 4:27 pm
by The Bytown Boozer
HFBoards, despite its glaring flaws, is still a great place to talk about the international game.

You just hafta stay away from the Scandinavian pissing contests.

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2015 8:30 am
by mcphee
Psycho Papa Joe wrote:Best eligible player not in the Hall of Fame. Obviously the likes of Dick Duff and Clark Gillies were better hockey players. The Hall would never lie.


In style, wouldn't Lafleur be a good comparable for Makarov ? I remember him as a player that if you did everything right against him, all game, at one point he'd make a play and beat you.

My problem in evaluating great int'l players is that we judge from different criteria, at least I do. Take Duff and Gillies, if you saw the players, you'd follow their games through long seasons, leading into playoffs and get an idea whether they ranked with the best as the games got more important. The season and playoffs were the meal, int'l tournaments were dessert.

From a different perspective, those tournaments were the main course. It'd be ridiculous to try and mount any kind of argument that the Duffs' and Gillies' of the world were close to the player Makarov was but my guess is that guys voting remembered them as key parts of Stanley Cup winning teams.

A Mtl radio guy has always used the hof criteria as simply saying the guy's name and giving a quick answer, hof'er or not ? Makarov obviously is.

I'm not really for or against the other guys being there, some guys need to have their accomplishments subjected to some analysis before people realize all that they accomplished, but some guys are obvious.

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2015 9:52 am
by PPJ
mcphee wrote:
Psycho Papa Joe wrote:Best eligible player not in the Hall of Fame. Obviously the likes of Dick Duff and Clark Gillies were better hockey players. The Hall would never lie.


In style, wouldn't Lafleur be a good comparable for Makarov ? I remember him as a player that if you did everything right against him, all game, at one point he'd make a play and beat you.

My problem in evaluating great int'l players is that we judge from different criteria, at least I do. Take Duff and Gillies, if you saw the players, you'd follow their games through long seasons, leading into playoffs and get an idea whether they ranked with the best as the games got more important. The season and playoffs were the meal, int'l tournaments were dessert.

From a different perspective, those tournaments were the main course. It'd be ridiculous to try and mount any kind of argument that the Duffs' and Gillies' of the world were close to the player Makarov was but my guess is that guys voting remembered them as key parts of Stanley Cup winning teams.

A Mtl radio guy has always used the hof criteria as simply saying the guy's name and giving a quick answer, hof'er or not ? Makarov obviously is.

I'm not really for or against the other guys being there, some guys need to have their accomplishments subjected to some analysis before people realize all that they accomplished, but some guys are obvious.


The Hall should just say it's a NA HOF and be done with it, but they opened the door by allowing non-NHLers like Tretiak and Kharlamov in. Sure those two did great things in games against Canada, but so did Makarov. Other than Gretzky, was there a better forward in the world in the 80's, beginning to end? If they allow those two in, there simply is no sane argument to exclude Makarov, who's sole mistake seems to have not had a chance to play for the Wings like Fetisov and Larionov did. Really, in what universe was Larionov ever a better player than Makarov? Larionov was basically to Makarov what Lemaire was to Lafleur going back to your example.

As for Duff, you saw him and others, but I have a hard time thinking he was a better player than his non-HOF teammates, JC Tremblay and Provost just going by the stories my dad used to tell me. Am I wrong on that?

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:28 am
by mcphee
Psycho Papa Joe wrote:
mcphee wrote:
Psycho Papa Joe wrote:Best eligible player not in the Hall of Fame. Obviously the likes of Dick Duff and Clark Gillies were better hockey players. The Hall would never lie.


In style, wouldn't Lafleur be a good comparable for Makarov ? I remember him as a player that if you did everything right against him, all game, at one point he'd make a play and beat you.

My problem in evaluating great int'l players is that we judge from different criteria, at least I do. Take Duff and Gillies, if you saw the players, you'd follow their games through long seasons, leading into playoffs and get an idea whether they ranked with the best as the games got more important. The season and playoffs were the meal, int'l tournaments were dessert.

From a different perspective, those tournaments were the main course. It'd be ridiculous to try and mount any kind of argument that the Duffs' and Gillies' of the world were close to the player Makarov was but my guess is that guys voting remembered them as key parts of Stanley Cup winning teams.

A Mtl radio guy has always used the hof criteria as simply saying the guy's name and giving a quick answer, hof'er or not ? Makarov obviously is.

I'm not really for or against the other guys being there, some guys need to have their accomplishments subjected to some analysis before people realize all that they accomplished, but some guys are obvious.


The Hall should just say it's a NA HOF and be done with it, but they opened the door by allowing non-NHLers like Tretiak and Kharlamov in. Sure those two did great things in games against Canada, but so did Makarov. Other than Gretzky, was there a better forward in the world in the 80's, beginning to end? If they allow those two in, there simply is no sane argument to exclude Makarov, who's sole mistake seems to have not had a chance to play for the Wings like Fetisov and Larionov did. Really, in what universe was Larionov ever a better player than Makarov? Larionov was basically to Makarov what Lemaire was to Lafleur going back to your example.

As for Duff, you saw him and others, but I have a hard time thinking he was a better player than his non-HOF teammates, JC Tremblay and Provost just going by the stories my dad used to tell me. Am I wrong on that?


Duff was a lot like Justin Williams. Clever player, played better in big games, complimented good players as a linemate. Excelled on great Leaf team of the early 60's as well as great CH team of mid to late 60's. I think being in the hall for him is a bit of a stretch, if he toiled on the Rangers on the periphery of great teams, he'd not be there. He did win though so...

Provost was a great checking forward who'd score. I'm sure that when Gainey was drafted, Bowman thought that he had his Claude Provost. JC Tremblay was a great d man, he'd be earning 7-8M today. He wasn't very popular because he shied away from the rough stuff, and I get the impression he was a bit of a different type, but there are far worse d men in the hall than him. Being Habs probably hurt them, probably felt that you couldn't induct them all.

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2015 2:08 am
by Dr_Chimera
I think HHOF's criteria for inducting non-NHLer Euros is that these Euros have to be important newsmakers in the West.

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2015 5:43 am
by The Bytown Boozer
Image

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2015 12:49 pm
by PPJ
Dr_Chimera wrote:I think HHOF's criteria for inducting non-NHLer Euros is that these Euros have to be important newsmakers in the West.


Yeah, Mcphee already said that Doc. Jeez.

That said, I look at the numbers and Makarov did more in CCCP vs NHL games than Kharlamov did. Should have got Messier to break his ankle in one of the Canada Cups I guess and be some sort of hockey martyr like Kharlamov. He'd be in the Hall for sure.

PS Does anybody know if Makarov gives a shit?

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2015 12:50 pm
by PPJ
The Bytown Boozer wrote:Image


Real men don't need no stinkin mask.

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 9:20 pm
by Dr_Chimera
LOL I phrased it way better, Joseph.

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 4:03 am
by The Bytown Boozer

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 7:30 am
by keshymarkyz
All of that diggy would pleasure more and more seriously :spam:

Re: Epic Sergei Makarov post

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 9:41 pm
by Dr_Chimera
I think due to the last update they did HFBoards lost half of their threads. That's karma, I guess.