The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #151 by LeafOfBread » Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:48 pm



Bobby Orr on how Matthews feels about Tavares joining the @MapleLeafs “I’ve spoken with Auston. He’s thrilled. He’s thrilled that John’s coming. His goal is to be on a Stanley Cup team, and obviously having John on the team is going to help.”



Is there really a controversy surrounding the Captaincy in @MapleLeafs? “That’s bull about him being upset about the captaincy. That’s so wrong. They’re a good team & they’re going to be a very good team, John puts them closer to their goal. That’s what Auston is concerned about”
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #152 by LeafOfBread » Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:59 pm

I'm starting to think Shanahan had a pretty strong leash on Lou.



:rudy: I mean I assume his salary is low enough that he can be buried if need be, but why a guy like this is getting a 4 yr deal is mind boggling.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #153 by vf » Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:16 pm

Leo, Matt Martin, clutterbuck and this guy. They may be tough, but they'll never catch anyone.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #154 by LeafOfBread » Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:19 pm

vf wrote:Leo, Matt Martin, clutterbuck and this guy. They may be tough, but they'll never catch anyone.

According to Mirtle once Dubas took over all talks with Polak's agent on a new deal had also ceased.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #155 by AGENT ZERO » Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:15 pm

LeafOfBread wrote:
vf wrote:Leo, Matt Martin, clutterbuck and this guy. They may be tough, but they'll never catch anyone.

According to Mirtle once Dubas took over all talks with Polak's agent on a new deal had also ceased.


Lou is stuck in the old NHL, replacing him with Dubas is the most significant move made this offseason.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #156 by Philthy Thrillz » Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:58 am

I'm sold on Dub. Young, genius, calculated(same as JT) That in itself probably made JT feel rejuvenated, and was a big part in landing the unicorn.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #157 by Philthy Thrillz » Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:01 am

I wanted Hunter, but this isn't even close. Hands down a great decision by Shanny.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #158 by Philthy Thrillz » Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:05 am

vf wrote:Leo, Matt Martin, clutterbuck and this guy. They may be tough, but they'll never catch anyone.


It's all about speed now and in the future. My buddy Rosen is going to impress at camp.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #159 by Cunning Stunt II » Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:39 am

Have a look at this boy. Tavares and Mathews on thew ice together. (about the 25 second mark)





:17dance:
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #160 by WTF » Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:49 am

It's a thing of beauty, CS.

On a side note, I'd laugh pretty damn hard if Matthews, Nylander and Marner all signed extensions this offseason, leaving the media with nothing else to write about.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #161 by MonkeyWrench » Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:41 am

[■] hot dog diet
[■] players somehow upset with god walking into room
[■] contractual issues

Hmmm...
Oh i got it!

[□] cant afford all the great players. Absolute must trade situation! Mix in some stupidity from one of the parties.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #162 by LeafOfBread » Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:09 am

Yzerman re-signs Kucherov for 9.5 AAV. Hopefully this helps with the Matthews / Marner negotiations. It's nice that the comparables now aren't just retarded contracts signed by Edmonton and Buffalo.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #163 by AGENT ZERO » Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:23 am

They need to do something about the state tax difference in the NHL because it's bs that a team like Tampa Bay can pay players less under the cap and still give them more in real dollars. There is no way that a player of Kucherov's status and production should be making sub 10.5M
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #164 by Whit Dickman » Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:40 am

Crazy that he took such a discount. He probably could have gotten 12 on the open market
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #165 by AGENT ZERO » Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:51 am

Whit Dickman wrote:Crazy that he took such a discount. He probably could have gotten 12 on the open market


He is making more than JT in real dollars.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #166 by Dynrehab » Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:17 am

AGENT ZERO wrote:
Whit Dickman wrote:Crazy that he took such a discount. He probably could have gotten 12 on the open market


He is making more than JT in real dollars.


Should they also adjust for endorsement opportunities?

These guys hire smart people to invest their money properly and limit taxes paid. I think it is a fan issue more than a real issue. He could get traded tomorrow and pay higher taxes so I’d imagine he takes that into consideration.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #167 by paulster » Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:18 am

Dynrehab wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
Whit Dickman wrote:Crazy that he took such a discount. He probably could have gotten 12 on the open market


He is making more than JT in real dollars.


Should they also adjust for endorsement opportunities?


What if a player gets traded?
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #168 by Whit Dickman » Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:27 am

Should they adjust for general shittiness?!?
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #169 by WTF » Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:30 am

What about players paid in Canadian Tire money and inactive McDonald's gift cards?
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #170 by Dynrehab » Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:14 pm

From a report a few years ago, Calgary and Edmonton have the lowest taxes to affect the NHL players. Leafs are around 20th.

https://www.taxpayer.com/media/CTF-Home ... antage.pdf
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #171 by clawfirst » Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:41 pm

WTF wrote:What about players paid in Canadian Tire money and inactive McDonald's gift cards?

Ottawa fans could use a break from being kicked in the balls wtf.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #172 by cawbber » Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:53 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:They need to do something about the state tax difference in the NHL because it's bs that a team like Tampa Bay can pay players less under the cap and still give them more in real dollars. There is no way that a player of Kucherov's status and production should be making sub 10.5M

that shows commitment from Kucherov in helping keep the team together.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #173 by WTF » Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:02 pm

clawfirst wrote:
WTF wrote:What about players paid in Canadian Tire money and inactive McDonald's gift cards?

Ottawa fans could use a break from being kicked in the balls wtf.


The funny thing about people bringing up the tax advantage for TB is that TB fans instantly countered with the money teams like the Leafs could spend on non-roster resources like coaching/management and how there should be a cap there, which immediately made me think about how screwed the Sens would be if a floor were implemented too. The six(!) members of the Snes front office would either need massive raises or Melnyk would have to find another way to pay staff (free expired pharmaceuticals?).
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #174 by Whit Dickman » Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:17 pm

They have just six guys in the front office? Haha, we must have like 20
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #175 by mooseOAK » Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:21 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:They need to do something about the state tax difference in the NHL because it's bs that a team like Tampa Bay can pay players less under the cap and still give them more in real dollars. There is no way that a player of Kucherov's status and production should be making sub 10.5M

If they aren’t signing away players from other teams then why should we care?
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #176 by LeafOfBread » Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:28 pm

Dynrehab wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
Whit Dickman wrote:Crazy that he took such a discount. He probably could have gotten 12 on the open market


He is making more than JT in real dollars.


Should they also adjust for endorsement opportunities?

These guys hire smart people to invest their money properly and limit taxes paid. I think it is a fan issue more than a real issue. He could get traded tomorrow and pay higher taxes so I’d imagine he takes that into consideration.

This. I recall reading some in depth analysis around this and they basically concluded that due to some loopholes / rules that could be worked around, the taxes paid difference really doesn't end up being as much as the media reports or that the average fan thinks. It's not as simple as 'apply x% federal + provincial/state rate'. The difference actually only ends up being a few hundred thousand rather than 1-2 million/yr like the media reports.

Plus, getting paid in USD is also a nice advantage of playing here.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #177 by WTF » Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:34 pm

I've always wondered, is it possible for a player to be paid as a contracted "employee" of a company registered in the Bahamas? So a team would be subcontracting the player via said company.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #178 by AGENT ZERO » Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:09 pm

LeafOfBread wrote:
Dynrehab wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
He is making more than JT in real dollars.


Should they also adjust for endorsement opportunities?

These guys hire smart people to invest their money properly and limit taxes paid. I think it is a fan issue more than a real issue. He could get traded tomorrow and pay higher taxes so I’d imagine he takes that into consideration.

This. I recall reading some in depth analysis around this and they basically concluded that due to some loopholes / rules that could be worked around, the taxes paid difference really doesn't end up being as much as the media reports or that the average fan thinks. It's not as simple as 'apply x% federal + provincial/state rate'. The difference actually only ends up being a few hundred thousand rather than 1-2 million/yr like the media reports.

Plus, getting paid in USD is also a nice advantage of playing here.


I read the same report, but you still have to put your money into bonds which cannot be touched until retirement, and even then there is still a difference. If money was a deciding factor for me I would definitely play in Tampa. I understand the argument about endorsements, but that is off ice revenue, and it makes sense that you would be paid more for playing in a market that generates more revenue for the companies and the league.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #179 by Whit Dickman » Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:40 pm

The other thing about Tampa is that it's in Florida. I would avoid living in the US as much as possible... and Florida, in particular, is fucked
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #180 by WTF » Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:59 pm

True. The true downside to the beneficial tax situation is you have to live in a place surrounded by Floridians.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #181 by Dynrehab » Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:25 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:
LeafOfBread wrote:
Dynrehab wrote:
Should they also adjust for endorsement opportunities?

These guys hire smart people to invest their money properly and limit taxes paid. I think it is a fan issue more than a real issue. He could get traded tomorrow and pay higher taxes so I’d imagine he takes that into consideration.

This. I recall reading some in depth analysis around this and they basically concluded that due to some loopholes / rules that could be worked around, the taxes paid difference really doesn't end up being as much as the media reports or that the average fan thinks. It's not as simple as 'apply x% federal + provincial/state rate'. The difference actually only ends up being a few hundred thousand rather than 1-2 million/yr like the media reports.

Plus, getting paid in USD is also a nice advantage of playing here.


I read the same report, but you still have to put your money into bonds which cannot be touched until retirement, and even then there is still a difference. If money was a deciding factor for me I would definitely play in Tampa. I understand the argument about endorsements, but that is off ice revenue, and it makes sense that you would be paid more for playing in a market that generates more revenue for the companies and the league.


Why would an $80 million player want to touch all of his money before retirement?
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #182 by paulster » Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:28 pm

Hell, put it ALL in to the retirement fund and just live off of IOU's for the next 13 years.

Image
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #183 by AGENT ZERO » Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:48 pm

Dynrehab wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
LeafOfBread wrote:This. I recall reading some in depth analysis around this and they basically concluded that due to some loopholes / rules that could be worked around, the taxes paid difference really doesn't end up being as much as the media reports or that the average fan thinks. It's not as simple as 'apply x% federal + provincial/state rate'. The difference actually only ends up being a few hundred thousand rather than 1-2 million/yr like the media reports.

Plus, getting paid in USD is also a nice advantage of playing here.


I read the same report, but you still have to put your money into bonds which cannot be touched until retirement, and even then there is still a difference. If money was a deciding factor for me I would definitely play in Tampa. I understand the argument about endorsements, but that is off ice revenue, and it makes sense that you would be paid more for playing in a market that generates more revenue for the companies and the league.


Why would an $80 million player want to touch all of his money before retirement?


All things being similar, why would I pick the option where all of my money is not available to me? Additionally, it is a sizable amount of money that would not be made available, essentially the difference in tax rates.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #184 by Dynrehab » Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:28 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:
Dynrehab wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
I read the same report, but you still have to put your money into bonds which cannot be touched until retirement, and even then there is still a difference. If money was a deciding factor for me I would definitely play in Tampa. I understand the argument about endorsements, but that is off ice revenue, and it makes sense that you would be paid more for playing in a market that generates more revenue for the companies and the league.


Why would an $80 million player want to touch all of his money before retirement?


All things being similar, why would I pick the option where all of my money is not available to me? Additionally, it is a sizable amount of money that would not be made available, essentially the difference in tax rates.


No matter where they live, they are sheltering most of their income to the extent possible because they still pay federal tax rates in either country.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #185 by paulster » Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:46 pm

Well, we figured it out. I guess nobody will ever sign here in Toronto again.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #186 by Dynrehab » Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:30 pm

paulster wrote:Well, we figured it out. I guess nobody will ever sign here in Toronto again.

Montrealand California are the worst.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #187 by Whit Dickman » Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:17 am

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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #188 by Thomas Malthus » Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:32 pm

Interesting writeup on two new staff members joining the Leafs as pro scouts: https://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2018 ... aple-leafs
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #189 by Curry Rage » Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:13 am

Whit Dickman wrote:https://twitter.com/Kathy0727/status/1016517814558035968?s=19

Whatever you do, don't *punch* him. They get all pissy about that.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #190 by Curry Rage » Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:17 am

Thomas Malthus wrote:Interesting writeup on two new staff members joining the Leafs as pro scouts: https://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2018 ... aple-leafs


It's the dog days, but personally it's hard to get excited over an article about a junior lawyer guy. Nothing personal to Ed's bro, mind you. I'm sure he'll do a great job.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #191 by Thomas Malthus » Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:34 am

Curry Rage wrote:
Thomas Malthus wrote:Interesting writeup on two new staff members joining the Leafs as pro scouts: https://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2018 ... aple-leafs


It's the dog days, but personally it's hard to get excited over an article about a junior lawyer guy. Nothing personal to Ed's bro, mind you. I'm sure he'll do a great job.


Yeah, the only real “exciting” part seems to be that we’re attracting people who are overqualified because they want to be part of this organization. Given that Gilman may not be long for this org, it’s good to have a stable of potential replacements.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #192 by Curry Rage » Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:37 am

True. Money talks.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #193 by WTF » Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:02 am

I think it's a combination of money and momentum.

People around the league have to have noticed that there's the potential for something special when a young team, two years removed from finishing dead last, has just set a new club record for points for a club that just recently celebrated its centennial.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #194 by Curry Rage » Thu Jul 12, 2018 4:57 pm

WTF wrote:I think it's a combination of money and momentum.

People around the league have to have noticed that there's the potential for something special when a young team, two years removed from finishing dead last, has just set a new club record for points for a club that just recently celebrated its centennial.


Sure. As does the belief that the working environment will be good. But, from Babcock on down, this company spends money on the off ice staff. It's not a bad thing. It's a strength we should utilise. There have to be some perks to helping keep the league afloat with your brand.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #195 by Thomas Malthus » Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:10 pm

I’d like to see them expand the skills development staff. Goalies get way more one-on-one skills coaching than players do. Use those off-ice resources to get players more of that individualized skill coaching. The app with breakdowns for the prospects from the recent dev camp is a good start but I think they can still do better.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #196 by WTF » Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:13 pm

For sure. There's no salary cap for non-roster expenditures so MLSE might as well flex its financial muscle (in a sensible fashion) on management, coaching, scouting, training and development, sports science, analytics, etc.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #197 by Curry Rage » Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:20 pm

Johnsson signed a one-year deal. Will be RFA at the end.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #198 by WTF » Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:25 pm

Yeah, Johnsson accepted his QO. If he can deliver as expected this coming season, he's getting paid.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #199 by Curry Rage » Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:28 pm

He's going to have to be pretty damn good to get the ice time to earn a killer deal. Lots of guys ahead of him depth wise.
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Re: The Quest for Lord Stanley's Goblet: Our Toronto Leafs 2018-2019 General Discussion

Post #200 by Philthy Thrillz » Fri Jul 13, 2018 8:40 pm

2.5 next deal. Four years.

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