Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

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Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #1 by Honus Joglund » Mon Jan 15, 2018 11:09 pm

Fingers crossed:

Rielly - Hainsey
Gardiner - Dermott
Borgman - Carrick
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #2 by Thomas Malthus » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:13 am

Honus Joglund wrote:Fingers crossed:

Rielly - Hainsey
Gardiner - Dermott
Borgman - Carrick


Were those pairings posted somewhere or are you just hoping that's what we'll see?
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #3 by LeafOfBread » Tue Jan 16, 2018 10:08 am

Thomas Malthus wrote:
Honus Joglund wrote:Fingers crossed:

Rielly - Hainsey
Gardiner - Dermott
Borgman - Carrick


Were those pairings posted somewhere or are you just hoping that's what we'll see?


I have bad news for both of you. Yesterday in practice Babcock had Dermott with Polak and Borgman as the extra.

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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #4 by Whit Dickman » Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:14 pm

Honus Joglund wrote:Fingers crossed:

Rielly - Hainsey
Gardiner - Dermott
Borgman - Carrick


Won't happen because of PK. But when Zaitsev is back

Rielly - Hainsey
Gardiner - Dermott
Borgman - Zaitsev
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #5 by MonkeyWrench » Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:18 pm

Babcock's dream of Polak.

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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #6 by AGENT ZERO » Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:30 pm

Whit Dickman wrote:
Honus Joglund wrote:Fingers crossed:

Rielly - Hainsey
Gardiner - Dermott
Borgman - Carrick


Won't happen because of PK. But when Zaitsev is back

Rielly - Hainsey
Gardiner - Dermott
Borgman - Zaitsev


Unfortunately, I think we are stuck with Polak unless a trade for a RHS occurs. Babcock is not going to go with 5 LHS/1 RHS combo, and he clearly prefers Polak to Carrick.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #7 by LeafOfBread » Tue Jan 16, 2018 3:21 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:
Whit Dickman wrote:
Honus Joglund wrote:Fingers crossed:

Rielly - Hainsey
Gardiner - Dermott
Borgman - Carrick


Won't happen because of PK. But when Zaitsev is back

Rielly - Hainsey
Gardiner - Dermott
Borgman - Zaitsev


Unfortunately, I think we are stuck with Polak unless a trade for a RHS occurs. Babcock is not going to go with 5 LHS/1 RHS combo, and he clearly prefers Polak to Carrick.

at this point i think it may take a tonya harding :trump2:
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #8 by Whit Dickman » Tue Jan 16, 2018 7:15 pm

How the fuck is there no instigator there?
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #9 by Honus Joglund » Tue Jan 16, 2018 7:28 pm

Whit Dickman wrote:How the fuck is there no instigator there?


Just National League officiallating. :df:
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #10 by Philthy Thrillz » Tue Jan 16, 2018 8:05 pm

How are the boys playing? Missing this game.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #11 by MonkeyWrench » Tue Jan 16, 2018 8:26 pm

Philthy Thrillz wrote:How are the boys playing? Missing this game.


Both teams started out with lots of energy. After the first 5min or so the blues started grinding us down.
2nd period has been more about playing it safe. Alot of stick, board work.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #12 by Honus Joglund » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:01 pm

These linesmen have been noticeably bad tonight, which is amazing considering they're linesmen.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #13 by WTF » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:16 pm

DOWNTOWN CONNOR BROWN!
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #14 by MonkeyWrench » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:16 pm

BROWN BABY!!
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #15 by Honus Joglund » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:16 pm

Good man, good family.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #16 by Dynrehab » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:17 pm

Joe Bowen: the little leprechaun gives the Leafs the lead.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #17 by stoney » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:36 pm

Kadri line has been shit all night. Still gets 35 seconds to hem themselves in
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #18 by MonkeyWrench » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:36 pm

And matthews being molested doesn't get a peantly called. Ofcourse this happens after.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #19 by stoney » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:38 pm

MonkeyWrench wrote:And matthews being molested doesn't get a peantly called. Ofcourse this happens after.


That was a bit much. He is a star player.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #20 by MonkeyWrench » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:42 pm

unbelievable...
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #21 by WTF » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:42 pm

Fucking horseshit that Matthews can get crosschecked and mugged without getting a call.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #22 by stoney » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:42 pm

Bunch of the same. Marner with a gutless check on that play.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #23 by LeafOfBread » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:43 pm

LOL, 3 chokes in a row. Marner was pathetic defensively there.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #24 by MonkeyWrench » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:44 pm

Im fine with Matthews or Babcock taking a fine for calling out the refs why a penalty wasn't called.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #25 by AGENT ZERO » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:46 pm

This is not a very good hockey team, when is the last time the Leafs won in regulation?
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #26 by AGENT ZERO » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:48 pm

MonkeyWrench wrote:Im fine with Matthews or Babcock taking a fine for calling out the refs why a penalty wasn't called.


There were some missed calls, but the Leafs didn't lose because of officiating, and they haven't been losing because of officiating. The Leafs can't score goals right now..
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #27 by stoney » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:54 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:This is not a very good hockey team, when is the last time the Leafs won in regulation?


Shuffle the fucking lines.

Show me JVR with Matthews and Brown/Hyman. Nylander with Kadri and Marleau.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #28 by Thomas Malthus » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:56 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:
MonkeyWrench wrote:Im fine with Matthews or Babcock taking a fine for calling out the refs why a penalty wasn't called.


There were some missed calls, but the Leafs didn't lose because of officiating, and they haven't been losing because of officiating. The Leafs can't score goals right now..


Conditional on reaching that stage in the game, that non-call has huge implications for the game's outcome. The Leafs may not been playing well lately but there's no way you can't call that a huge fuck up that directly influenced the outcome of the game.

Stepping back beyond that bullshit of a non-call, the team looks fucking broken. I'm not sure what's going on but, and I know I'm going to get slammed for this, I think a lot of it has to do with management and coaching.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #29 by AGENT ZERO » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:57 pm

stoney wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:This is not a very good hockey team, when is the last time the Leafs won in regulation?


Shuffle the fucking lines.

Show me JVR with Matthews and Brown/Hyman. Nylander with Kadri and Marleau.


Forget line shuffling, why don't they use the young depth they have on the Marlies, and in the press-box. Give Leivo and Johnsson some minutes, and move on from the Komarov's and Martin's of the world. I'm also kind of souring on Marleau, after a really good start he has slowed down considerably.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #30 by AGENT ZERO » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:59 pm

Thomas Malthus wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
MonkeyWrench wrote:Im fine with Matthews or Babcock taking a fine for calling out the refs why a penalty wasn't called.


There were some missed calls, but the Leafs didn't lose because of officiating, and they haven't been losing because of officiating. The Leafs can't score goals right now..


Conditional on reaching that stage in the game, that non-call has huge implications for the game's outcome. The Leafs may not been playing well lately but there's no way you can't call that a huge fuck up that directly influenced the outcome of the game.

Stepping back beyond that bullshit of a non-call, the team looks fucking broken. I'm not sure what's going on but, and I know I'm going to get slammed for this, I think a lot of it has to do with management and coaching.


You are probably right, I'm just fed up with the coaching and roster decisions at this point. So everything else is kind of secondary for me.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #31 by Thomas Malthus » Tue Jan 16, 2018 10:02 pm

I hope Dubas is announced as the GM this summer, which may begin sooner that last year's offseason. I have to hope that he's going to take away Babcock's toys, Moneyballl style.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #32 by clawfirst » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:28 am

They are being coached to play for the tie. Its not that big a deal
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Post #33 by Dynrehab » Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:51 am

Thomas Malthus wrote:I hope Dubas is announced as the GM this summer, which may begin sooner that last year's offseason. I have to hope that he's going to take away Babcock's toys, Moneyballl style.


The money all you will get is young guys like Dermott, Goat and KAPANEN replacing a few guys who are more expensive.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #34 by Curry Rage » Wed Jan 17, 2018 3:23 am

Why are you shouting?
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #35 by Curry Rage » Wed Jan 17, 2018 3:34 am

clawfirst wrote:They are being coached to play for the tie. Its not that big a deal


Babs and Lou with Lemaire helping. Not sure what anyone expected.

I remember a time when going Score Adjusted Corsi for Score Adjusted Corsi at 5v5 and grinding out a point in a close game with one of the better teams in the league would've been lauded. We're a mediocre team solidly in the playoff mix. This is a major step forward for a team that drafted 1st overall two years ago. How are things in Edmonton and Buffalo?
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #36 by Curry Rage » Wed Jan 17, 2018 5:33 am

Dynrehab wrote:
Thomas Malthus wrote:I hope Dubas is announced as the GM this summer, which may begin sooner that last year's offseason. I have to hope that he's going to take away Babcock's toys, Moneyballl style.


The money all you will get is young guys like Dermott, Goat and KAPANEN replacing a few guys who are more expensive.


Yup. It seems most of the complaints are about Leo and Polak. Neither guy is going to be around forever. Brownie will see more ice soon.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #37 by Thomas Malthus » Wed Jan 17, 2018 8:22 am

So you guys are telling me, if you guys were on the management team and were looking back over the past few months you're thinking "good job guys, that's what winning hockey looks like"?
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #38 by Philthy Thrillz » Wed Jan 17, 2018 8:28 am

Thomas Malthus wrote:So you guys are telling me, if you guys were on the management team and were looking back over the past few months you're thinking "good job guys, that's what winning hockey looks like"?



Not bad for a team that comprises 50% sophomores.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #39 by Philthy Thrillz » Wed Jan 17, 2018 8:31 am

I didn't watch the game and haven't seen the replays, but playing the Blues to a 1-1 overtime lose sounds like a small victory.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #40 by mooseOAK » Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:24 am

You’ve seen this game before and will again. Point accumulation is the order of the day and will be until the playoffs which will likely be the next time the Leafs play a must win game.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #41 by clawfirst » Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:28 am

Thomas Malthus wrote:So you guys are telling me, if you guys were on the management team and were looking back over the past few months you're thinking "good job guys, that's what winning hockey looks like"?

Well no...because its boring as fuck to watch.

It will all make sense when the rule book is cut in half in the last 20 games and playoffs. And polak will be actually useful.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #42 by Dynrehab » Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:31 am

Thomas Malthus wrote:So you guys are telling me, if you guys were on the management team and were looking back over the past few months you're thinking "good job guys, that's what winning hockey looks like"?


I’d look at the 11 point playoff cushion and recognize the Hall of Fame coach has an opportunity to try some stuff and get prepared for the playoffs. Health, fresh legs and multiple systems are a thing in the playoffs. This team has 2 lines that can matchup defensively, and 3 sometimes 4 lines that can score. They are ok with a few warts.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #43 by LeafOfBread » Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:34 am

Dynrehab wrote:
Thomas Malthus wrote:So you guys are telling me, if you guys were on the management team and were looking back over the past few months you're thinking "good job guys, that's what winning hockey looks like"?


I’d look at the 11 point playoff cushion and recognize the Hall of Fame coach has an opportunity to try some stuff and get prepared for the playoffs. Health, fresh legs and multiple systems are a thing in the playoffs. This team has 2 lines that can matchup defensively, and 3 sometimes 4 lines that can score. They are ok with a few warts.

I'd hope he's not just satisfied with that 3rd divisional spot though. I mean, at the very least getting home ice over Boston would be nice.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #44 by Curry Rage » Wed Jan 17, 2018 11:10 am

Thomas Malthus wrote:So you guys are telling me, if you guys were on the management team and were looking back over the past few months you're thinking "good job guys, that's what winning hockey looks like"?


No, but it's *teaching* them how to play the kind of hockey that wins close games and it's about the long haul, not present entertainment. As the others are saying, we have all the skill in the world to fly through the neutral zone and come at you in waves and none of it will mean shit in the playoffs against a big, strong defensive club that clogs up the neutral zone and forces you to play shitty, ugly chip-and-chase and the refs let them grab and interfere.

Babcock described last night's game as one of the "highest level" games they've been in all year. He loves a 1-0 win as much as anyone.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #45 by vf » Wed Jan 17, 2018 11:29 am

Thomas Malthus wrote:So you guys are telling me, if you guys were on the management team and were looking back over the past few months you're thinking "good job guys, that's what winning hockey looks like"?


I would think: There will be pain this is ugly hockey and it's regular fucking season, but, those floating fuckfaces are learning the hard way what it takes to win ugly. Carlyle got us into the playoffs and the team couldn't handle playoff hockey. I believe this team will be much better prepared to handle it. Because they've been forced to play ugly hockey. I figured you for a processes guy Thommy.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #46 by Thomas Malthus » Wed Jan 17, 2018 11:56 am

I am a process guy. I would have more time for this "preparation" argument if it was the kids getting all the ice time and being forced to learn. Instead it's questionable roster decisions and leaning on vets that aren't in the long term plans.

You can tell me that Babs wants to win now and is playing the guys he thinks will do that or you can tell me that he's trying to prepare the young players but you can't have both.

When I talk about how this team has played I'm talking about metrics that predict success well over the remaining schedule and ones that have described the team's play over the past months. Neither look great. If the team was supposed to be learning why haven't we seen improvement since the style switch?
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #47 by Curry Rage » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:08 pm

Not sayin' (just sayin) but it doesn't surprise me there's less talk about Dermott being robbed after a game in which he was 37% on the Corsiwicks in just 11 minutes. I haven't watched it yet, but there's always a learning curve for young D. Not surprised he didn't look like a world-beater against St. Loo's forecheck.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #48 by Curry Rage » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:14 pm

Thomas Malthus wrote:I am a process guy. I would have more time for this "preparation" argument if it was the kids getting all the ice time and being forced to learn. Instead it's questionable roster decisions and leaning on vets that aren't in the long term plans.


Unless you expect them to only play the kids in the playoffs and forevermore, that doesn't make much sense. Dude, we have Matthews, Hyman, Rielly, Marner, Nylander, etc. all playing big minutes. Sure, there are some vets around them. This ain't Edmonton.

You can tell me that Babs wants to win now and is playing the guys he thinks will do that or you can tell me that he's trying to prepare the young players but you can't have both.


Just did.

When I talk about how this team has played I'm talking about metrics that predict success well over the remaining schedule and ones that have described the team's play over the past months. Neither look great. If the team was supposed to be learning why haven't we seen improvement since the style switch?


Have you ever taught anyone anything? The process ain't linear. Sometimes we suck even more for a bit if we're changing from old habits to new ones.
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LeafOfBread
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #49 by LeafOfBread » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:24 pm

Curry Rage wrote:Not sayin' (just sayin) but it doesn't surprise me there's less talk about Dermott being robbed after a game in which he was 37% on the Corsiwicks in just 11 minutes. I haven't watched it yet, but there's always a learning curve for young D. Not surprised he didn't look like a world-beater against St. Loo's forecheck.

Eh, although that is a pretty terrible corsiwick, when your partner is someone whose relative impact on possession is negative for all but 2 players on the team, I wouldn't really hold it against him. Also, Babs actually used Dermott-Polak as a defensive pairing and sheltered the Gardiner-Carrick pairing more based on zone starts. In terms of the eye test, Dermott looked decent but I can admit that I have a bias as well.

In the grand scheme of things it makes what Borgman has been doing this season all the more impressive.
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Re: Good Bunch of Men host St. Louis Blues - 7:00 PM TSN

Post #50 by LeafOfBread » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:30 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:
stoney wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:This is not a very good hockey team, when is the last time the Leafs won in regulation?


Shuffle the fucking lines.

Show me JVR with Matthews and Brown/Hyman. Nylander with Kadri and Marleau.


Forget line shuffling, why don't they use the young depth they have on the Marlies, and in the press-box. Give Leivo and Johnsson some minutes, and move on from the Komarov's and Martin's of the world. I'm also kind of souring on Marleau, after a really good start he has slowed down considerably.

Marleau is at least still good defensively. Despite his matchup usage he still has a positive impact in shot suppression and everyone who is better than him in that regard is really sheltered except for Rielly (e.g. Bozak line, Borgman, etc.).

That line badly needs a shake-up though. Would love to see Kapanen slot in for Komarov there.

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