Big What...?

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Big What...?

Post #1 by Philthy Thrillz » Fri Oct 05, 2018 4:43 pm

WILLY OR PUSSY?

Lookin like a big blue waffle

:rudy:
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Re: Big What...?

Post #2 by clawfirst » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:47 pm

Is this the Nylander trade rumour fred?
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Re: Big What...?

Post #3 by paulster » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:11 pm

Big stupid agent?
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Re: Big What...?

Post #4 by Philthy Thrillz » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:43 pm

clawfirst wrote:Is this the Nylander trade rumour fred?



:why:
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Re: Big What...?

Post #5 by Philthy Thrillz » Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:00 pm

Real talk, claw.

Agent, player or management? Maybe a combination of a couple? The agent is notorious for dragging shit through the mud, doesn't give a shit, its a business. Management is coming in lower than being reported(not sure if there is a concrete report). 6.5 avv 6+ years seems to be right around the "fair" value. Willy doesn't want to play for Leafs/Babcock for various conspiracies.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #6 by Philthy Thrillz » Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:07 pm

Just reported on SC Marner would happily sign a deal mid season, and perfectly content waiting. Won't talk about negotiations through the media. That's good news.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #7 by clawfirst » Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:45 pm

Just dont worry about it. He either signs or is traded for something else useful.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #8 by clawfirst » Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:46 pm

Maybe even a vet d and shiny mystery box is what we need.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #9 by Philthy Thrillz » Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:52 pm

clawfirst wrote:Just dont worry about it. He either signs or is traded for something else useful.


Watching Ennis with Mathews was horrorawful. My panties are bunched. I want it resolved. I want everything to stay perfect. I want it Big Willy style.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #10 by Philthy Thrillz » Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:02 pm

I predict a 6 year 6.5 avv, before game 10.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #11 by LeafOfBread » Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:35 pm

Philthy Thrillz wrote:I predict a 6 year 6.5 avv, before game 10.

I think so too. Maybe 6.75 max.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #12 by stoney » Sat Oct 06, 2018 9:50 am

I don't care about Draisaitl comparison, Pasternk is the division comparable. Better season, showed up in the playoffs, gets 6.6 per.

I appreciate getting as much as possible, that's the agents job. However, cherry picking comparables when a (currently) more effective player is sitting right in their face....i don't see how you can expect more than that.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #13 by vf » Sat Oct 06, 2018 11:21 am

We need guys to buy in. If they want big bucks that is their prerogative, and they can enjoy it in Edmonton or Ottawa or some other shit hole that won't win a thing in their careers.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #14 by LeafOfBread » Sat Oct 06, 2018 2:02 pm

vf wrote:. If they want big bucks


vf wrote: Ottawa .


:donger:
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Re: Big What...?

Post #15 by AGENT ZERO » Sat Oct 06, 2018 3:54 pm

stoney wrote:I don't care about Draisaitl comparison, Pasternk is the division comparable. Better season, showed up in the playoffs, gets 6.6 per.

I appreciate getting as much as possible, that's the agents job. However, cherry picking comparables when a (currently) more effective player is sitting right in their face....i don't see how you can expect more than that.


What you are doing is also cherry picking. Additionally, the cap has increased so you need to look at percentage of cap when doing comparables and not just raw dollars and cents. My guess is they settle in around 7M with term.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #16 by AGENT ZERO » Sat Oct 06, 2018 3:55 pm

vf wrote:We need guys to buy in. If they want big bucks that is their prerogative, and they can enjoy it in Edmonton or Ottawa or some other shit hole that won't win a thing in their careers.


Why is the alternative the two worst run franchises in the NHL? You can get paid and play on a winning team.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #17 by AGENT ZERO » Sat Oct 06, 2018 4:01 pm

I also dont believe it is fair to single out Nylander when none of the big 3 have signed. People are talking about Matthews getting 12, Mitch getting 10, but for some reason Nylander at 8 is a travesty. I dont get it myself, if I were in their shoes I would try to get paid too. Taking a discount when the team can turn around and trade you has always seemed like a dumb decision to me. *shrugs*
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Re: Big What...?

Post #18 by Whit Dickman » Sat Oct 06, 2018 4:28 pm

Those are all too expensive by at least 2 million. Marner might get 8 because he gets to wait this year. If Nylander had that luxury he might be getting 8 too. (Marner and Nylander are similar, although Billy is a year older. Hence the difference)
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Re: Big What...?

Post #19 by vf » Sat Oct 06, 2018 4:39 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:
vf wrote:We need guys to buy in. If they want big bucks that is their prerogative, and they can enjoy it in Edmonton or Ottawa or some other shit hole that won't win a thing in their careers.


Why is the alternative the two worst run franchises in the NHL? You can get paid and play on a winning team.


I don't know what his demand is, but I'll assume it's too much because he's not signed yet. You can't overpay for him when the next 3 are coming. And it goes for all of them about their contracts. I also don't give a shit about a winning team, I want cups.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #20 by clawfirst » Sat Oct 06, 2018 4:51 pm

Im not gonna care till late November
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Re: Big What...?

Post #21 by Philthy Thrillz » Sat Oct 06, 2018 5:23 pm

clawfirst wrote:Im not gonna care till late November


You just admitted you cared. Welcome back.

:grabo:
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Re: Big What...?

Post #22 by Philthy Thrillz » Sat Oct 06, 2018 5:31 pm

10 + months dry as a nuns cunt, claw.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #23 by clawfirst » Sat Oct 06, 2018 5:38 pm

Congrats and condolences. I just keep it to the weekends now
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Re: Big What...?

Post #24 by WTF » Sat Oct 06, 2018 5:49 pm

Congrats PT. Think of it this way: at least you didn't try doing it during any of the 18-wheeler seasons. That shit came close to driving me to drink.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #25 by AGENT ZERO » Sat Oct 06, 2018 5:53 pm

vf wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
vf wrote:We need guys to buy in. If they want big bucks that is their prerogative, and they can enjoy it in Edmonton or Ottawa or some other shit hole that won't win a thing in their careers.


Why is the alternative the two worst run franchises in the NHL? You can get paid and play on a winning team.


I don't know what his demand is, but I'll assume it's too much because he's not signed yet. You can't overpay for him when the next 3 are coming. And it goes for all of them about their contracts. I also don't give a shit about a winning team, I want cups.


You didn't answer the question.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #26 by AGENT ZERO » Sat Oct 06, 2018 5:55 pm

Whit Dickman wrote:Those are all too expensive by at least 2 million. Marner might get 8 because he gets to wait this year. If Nylander had that luxury he might be getting 8 too. (Marner and Nylander are similar, although Billy is a year older. Hence the difference)


I agree on Marner, Matthews is getting at worst what Tavares makes, and my guess is a little bit more because he is better and because the cap is going up.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #27 by Philthy Thrillz » Sat Oct 06, 2018 7:05 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:
Whit Dickman wrote:Those are all too expensive by at least 2 million. Marner might get 8 because he gets to wait this year. If Nylander had that luxury he might be getting 8 too. (Marner and Nylander are similar, although Billy is a year older. Hence the difference)


I agree on Marner, Matthews is getting at worst what Tavares makes, and my guess is a little bit more because he is better and because the cap is going up.



To be sure Marner will be pressured to play D first and let his natural ability worry about scoring points. Babs will lean on him to play tougher minutes, PK, etc. That will balance his point inflation. Matthews should just sign for 11 now, I feel that's a forgone conclusion.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #28 by Dynrehab » Sat Oct 06, 2018 7:52 pm

vf wrote:We need guys to buy in. If they want big bucks that is their prerogative, and they can enjoy it in Edmonton or Ottawa or some other shit hole that won't win a thing in their careers.


Edmonton is cap broke and the Sens cheap as fuck.

Bad examples. Vancouver? Montreal?

Better examples maybe.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #29 by vf » Sat Oct 06, 2018 8:39 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:
vf wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
Why is the alternative the two worst run franchises in the NHL? You can get paid and play on a winning team.


I don't know what his demand is, but I'll assume it's too much because he's not signed yet. You can't overpay for him when the next 3 are coming. And it goes for all of them about their contracts. I also don't give a shit about a winning team, I want cups.


You didn't answer the question.


What's the difference between being paid and overpaid?
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Re: Big What...?

Post #30 by vf » Sat Oct 06, 2018 8:41 pm

Dynrehab wrote:
vf wrote:We need guys to buy in. If they want big bucks that is their prerogative, and they can enjoy it in Edmonton or Ottawa or some other shit hole that won't win a thing in their careers.


Edmonton is cap broke and the Sens cheap as fuck.

Bad examples. Vancouver? Montreal?

Better examples maybe.


They're both shit holes paying too much money to secondary players. I don't care what you want to call the shit hole.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #31 by Philthy Thrillz » Sun Oct 07, 2018 12:10 pm

Reported, both sides holding firm. It's been tight lipped from both sides, I love to know the Leafs offer.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #32 by AGENT ZERO » Sun Oct 07, 2018 12:48 pm

vf wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
vf wrote:
I don't know what his demand is, but I'll assume it's too much because he's not signed yet. You can't overpay for him when the next 3 are coming. And it goes for all of them about their contracts. I also don't give a shit about a winning team, I want cups.


You didn't answer the question.


What's the difference between being paid and overpaid?


Why is it Toronto or one of thr worst franchises in thrle NHL? I'm sure there are several really good teams that would pay Nylander upwards of 7M to play for them. Lets also be clear that the Leafs aren't asking Nylander to get paid his market value, they want him to take a haircut.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #33 by Philthy Thrillz » Sun Oct 07, 2018 12:59 pm

I wonder if it's under 6, that would definitely shift the blame.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #34 by AGENT ZERO » Sun Oct 07, 2018 1:10 pm

I think the Leafs probably want something under 7 and the Nylander camp wants something over 8, with neither side willing to meet in the middle as of yet. I still think it gets done at 7Mx6yrs.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #35 by vf » Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:34 pm

AZ you're kinda talking out both sides of your mouth. Several good teams would sign him at 7, but you're guessing he wants over 8. How many cup contenders throw 8 or more at Nylander?
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Re: Big What...?

Post #36 by Craig » Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:51 pm

The Hawks were contenders when they handed out the first 10+ contracts. The concept that good teams don't over pay seems unfounded to me.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #37 by AGENT ZERO » Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:29 pm

vf wrote:AZ you're kinda talking out both sides of your mouth. Several good teams would sign him at 7, but you're guessing he wants over 8. How many cup contenders throw 8 or more at Nylander?


I think the better question is which teams wouldnt.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #38 by MP » Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:11 pm

Meh, more losses to bottom league teams only work to Nylander's advantage. Shanahan going public saying guys have to take a discount isn't good either, surprised the NHLPA didn't comment on that.

Frankly, Willy is worth $7.5-8M longterm, and he'll regret taking less. If I'm him, I only take 6.5M on a one year deal. (also, I make this year all signing bonus on any deal, so holding out isn't costing him any money).
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Re: Big What...?

Post #39 by clawfirst » Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:58 pm

Trade him
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Re: Big What...?

Post #40 by Dynrehab » Mon Oct 08, 2018 11:21 am

MP wrote:Meh, more losses to bottom league teams only work to Nylander's advantage. Shanahan going public saying guys have to take a discount isn't good either, surprised the NHLPA didn't comment on that.

Frankly, Willy is worth $7.5-8M longterm, and he'll regret taking less. If I'm him, I only take 6.5M on a one year deal. (also, I make this year all signing bonus on any deal, so holding out isn't costing him any money).


How does a 1 year deal at $6.5 million help Nylander? That works perfectly for the Leafs and keeps his QO under $7 million. Right where the Leafs want to be. And still another year until he is eligible for arbitration.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #41 by Philthy Thrillz » Mon Oct 08, 2018 11:42 am

When Bill signs,

Kap Matthews Bill
Hyman JT Marner
Marleau Kadri Brown
Who cares
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Re: Big What...?

Post #42 by vf » Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:46 pm

Craig wrote:The Hawks were contenders when they handed out the first 10+ contracts. The concept that good teams don't over pay seems unfounded to me.


Seems you're having a hard time with reading comprehension. It's a long weekend so I forgive you Greg.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #43 by vf » Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:47 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:
vf wrote:AZ you're kinda talking out both sides of your mouth. Several good teams would sign him at 7, but you're guessing he wants over 8. How many cup contenders throw 8 or more at Nylander?


I think the better question is which teams wouldnt.


Any teams missing their 1st, 2nd 3rdthis year and possibly their 1st next year to be sure.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #44 by cawbber » Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:58 pm

MP wrote:Meh, more losses to bottom league teams only work to Nylander's advantage. Shanahan going public saying guys have to take a discount isn't good either, surprised the NHLPA didn't comment on that.

Frankly, Willy is worth $7.5-8M longterm, and he'll regret taking less. If I'm him, I only take 6.5M on a one year deal. (also, I make this year all signing bonus on any deal, so holding out isn't costing him any money).

Shanny only stating what is an obvious reality in a cap system.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #45 by WTF » Mon Oct 08, 2018 1:31 pm

vf wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
vf wrote:AZ you're kinda talking out both sides of your mouth. Several good teams would sign him at 7, but you're guessing he wants over 8. How many cup contenders throw 8 or more at Nylander?


I think the better question is which teams wouldnt.


Any teams missing their 1st, 2nd 3rdthis year and possibly their 1st next year to be sure.


And it's not like the Leafs are the only team operating under the cap so you can probably rule out any other teams close to the cap or with pending RFAs of their own who are due for some big raises.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #46 by AGENT ZERO » Mon Oct 08, 2018 1:35 pm

vf wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
vf wrote:AZ you're kinda talking out both sides of your mouth. Several good teams would sign him at 7, but you're guessing he wants over 8. How many cup contenders throw 8 or more at Nylander?


I think the better question is which teams wouldnt.


Any teams missing their 1st, 2nd 3rdthis year and possibly their 1st next year to be sure.


I wasnt talking about an offer sheet, and I'm not really sure why you are.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #47 by Geo » Mon Oct 08, 2018 1:38 pm

Philthy Thrillz wrote:When Bill signs,

Kap Matthews Bill
Hyman JT Marner
Marleau Kadri Brown
Who cares

How about:

Marleau - Matthews - Kapanen
Hyman - Tavares - Marner
Leivo - Kadri - Nylander
Johnsson* - Lindholm - Brown

*for lack of better options currently

That 1-2-3 punch of skill, speed, and possession.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #48 by vf » Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:12 pm

AGENT ZERO wrote:
vf wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
I think the better question is which teams wouldnt.


Any teams missing their 1st, 2nd 3rdthis year and possibly their 1st next year to be sure.


I wasnt talking about an offer sheet, and I'm not really sure why you are.


It's almost like Nylander is an RFA so the Leafs have no impetus to match any hypotheticals of what other teams would give him if compensation wasn't a part of the equation. Which it is.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #49 by AGENT ZERO » Mon Oct 08, 2018 3:34 pm

vf wrote:
AGENT ZERO wrote:
vf wrote:
Any teams missing their 1st, 2nd 3rdthis year and possibly their 1st next year to be sure.


I wasnt talking about an offer sheet, and I'm not really sure why you are.


It's almost like Nylander is an RFA so the Leafs have no impetus to match any hypotheticals of what other teams would give him if compensation wasn't a part of the equation. Which it is.


That is great, but it wasnt what we were discussing. If anything an offer sheet discredits your point because it opens Nylander up to choose a team to sign with rather than have one assigned to him by trade.
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Re: Big What...?

Post #50 by AGENT ZERO » Mon Oct 08, 2018 3:38 pm

Geo wrote:
Philthy Thrillz wrote:When Bill signs,

Kap Matthews Bill
Hyman JT Marner
Marleau Kadri Brown
Who cares

How about:

Marleau - Matthews - Kapanen
Hyman - Tavares - Marner
Leivo - Kadri - Nylander
Johnsson* - Lindholm - Brown

*for lack of better options currently

That 1-2-3 punch of skill, speed, and possession.


I like that better myself. We already know Matthews can drive a line by himself so that gives us three very dangerous lines with a play driver on each.

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