The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1001 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 1:46 pm

Slick Nick wrote:
Dog wrote:
Slick Nick wrote:
I'll put you on food stamps while working at Wallmart with a hungry child at home while methheads are overdosing on every corner and see how much you care about the bigger picture you entitled little prick. Besides, the duty of a governement in a demcoratic system is to provide security and opportunities for every sphere of the society, not to care about making people elsewhere less poor...


:why:

Nuance, friend.

What I’m saying: « things aren’t perfect, but the overwhelming trend in the last few centuries -especially the past decades- is towards spectacular improvement. So, let’s look at why. What works? I think the motor is specialization and innovation. So, let’s not kill that while we work to solve the remaining problems. »

What you’re saying: « people are hurting...arrrrghhhhhh...break stuff!!! »

:crossarms:


I'm mostly saying stop treating them like human garbage and losers (deplorables) that only have their own inadequacies to blame, and actually do something to improve their living conditions... and in order to do that, you first have to acknowledge what the real problem is (economy, stagnating wages, inequalities) and it is not (identity politics).


The real problem, nick, is higher level than that. Those are symptoms. What’s going on is that we are in accelerating economic transition to a post industrial and increasingly post (certain) services economy. And that is good. That is great! That is more wealth (which is something that is created by efficiency and innovation) and better living conditions. What it does though is have side effects. Those effects include making less skilled / non human relations jobs increasingly more expandable. Manufacturing has largely gone. The next wave will be largely technology driven. The biggest occupation for males in the US is driving things. That’s going to disappear by in large in the next years. Most clerical white color office jobs will as well. We certainly are in times of transition and we certainly have to get ahead of the curve and minimize impacts -hence why I’ve been harping about redistributive policies and have shifted pretty solidly to center left. What we don’t need to do is lose our minds and bite the hand that feeds you. The solution isn’t to revert to a pre-trade / pre-technological society. That would basically kill all human progress of the past decades/centuries. Seriously, in this thread, the initial post I replied to had you wanting to make shit in Murka. From a humanity perspective, how do you justify prioritizing working class americans (which, all things considered have it significantly better than most people in developing countries) above chinamens or vietnamese or africans? From an internal fairness perspective, how do you justify making everybody pay more for the thing (which will include millions and millions of poorer people) to give that guy a salary. It’s stupid. It’s basically a « give Bob money tax ».

These things need to be much more rational and universal in application. They also need to not be counter-productive and actually lower living conditioms and undo progress.

Moral outrage is fun, but the real worth is in actually solving things and that requires a cool head and measured approach -not a mindless sledgehammer because emotions!
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1002 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 1:50 pm

Dr_Chimera wrote:
Dog wrote:
Dr_Chimera wrote:America's gonna get universal healthcare 'cuz a bunch of folks stayed cool. Imagine writing that wall of shit for about 30 minutes.


Yeap. America IS going to get universal healthcare cause Obama and Dem controlled congress ramed through Obamacare, which would have been single payer were it not for Lieberman. So, they did the next best thing -the only thing they could do. And it worked. A GOP controlled congress and potus could not repeal it.....and the only logical way to fix it is to go universal. At this point, I think it’s inevitable. Question of time.

What did inactionable purist dreams accomplish meanwhile?


Thank goodness for good politicians who do good things.


By the by, you want universal healthcare in Murka or you want ideological purity in Murka?

Dems fought for single payer in 2008-10 and settled on Obamacare as the only thing that could get done as a long game that is actually working and they got destroyed in the 2010 midterms for it. Dems, using their 2008 majorities, got Americans the closest thing to universal healthcare that could have been gotten then and is now unrepeallable and likely to morph over time to actual universal healthcare.

You bitching because what? Wasn’t done in a romanticized enough manner for you?
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1003 by shredz » Thu Nov 08, 2018 1:55 pm

Not enough people died.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1004 by PredsFan77 » Thu Nov 08, 2018 2:45 pm

Yeah y’all dont care about the latest shooting
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1005 by Boring Choice #2 » Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:13 pm

They were dirty California libruls. Whaddya expect?
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1006 by shredz » Thu Nov 08, 2018 4:00 pm

America has lost its damned mind and no block of text shall save it. We already have that tower of font with our Constitution, Bill of Rights, etc.

Its currently and has been spit on by a list of administrations. Everything might seem fine but if you peel each layer back you get a darker, corrupted scheme going on that benefits people like Dog, with all due respect. I'm just a regular guy, had to scratch and claw for everything I've got (not saying you have not worked hard or earned where you are at) - but its really beyond even you. Its very few people that have to "open the levers." Even the so-called "good towns" are filled with drugs, abuse, you name it. Society as a whole is truly fucked unless The People of The Book are correct and some friendly bum comes back to rid these evils off the face of the earth. :trump:
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1007 by shredz » Thu Nov 08, 2018 4:09 pm

And that's how the Trump family was created



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:colbert:
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1008 by PredsFan77 » Thu Nov 08, 2018 4:22 pm

What
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1009 by shredz » Thu Nov 08, 2018 4:25 pm

Its an old protest placard.

America is screwed Predo, unless we really get our shit together. You're the one percent so I don't expect you to comprehend.



He kinda looks like the Planeters PeanutMan.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1010 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 6:14 pm

Nobody is saying your life is great, shredded wheat. Or even that life in general is great.

Only thing I’m saying is that it is, in the aggregate and on average, better and better (with occasional steps back).

You (same societal position) is better today than in 1980 than in 1950 than in 1900 than in 1800 than in 1500 than in 800.... it’s really taken off basically post industrial revolution and really picked up in the 20th century, especially in the second half. The world is undeniably getting much much richer, people living longer, people being healthier, people much less hungry, much less grinding poverty. These are all objective measure. Noticing progress isn’t the same as saying « everything is great, sit back and relax and stop complaining ». You can -and should- not be satisfied with the status quo. But you have to be rational in how you want to make it better. That very much includes recognizing what has been driving increase prosperity in living conditions theoughout the West and then the rest of the world in the last centuries and especially in the last decades. It’s specialization (which increases productivity and lowers costs) and innovation (science and tech). Nothing else. It litterally is about working together, specializing and collaborating -in a market economy as central planning has bigger flaws. Then, to me, it’s about the welfare state. The richer society providing ever more services to its citizens. Flatening the playing field and providing to those left behind. The last part is the battleground. Ensuring rich societies share fairly. Not killing what drives economic prosperity and innovation.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1011 by shredz » Thu Nov 08, 2018 6:17 pm

My zen has risen recently which is good. Good day, bad day, try not to take life for granted.




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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1012 by shredz » Thu Nov 08, 2018 6:20 pm



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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1013 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 7:51 pm

quickly googled a little data. these charts were the most informative, I found.

Image

Image

These are real income -so adjusted for inflation. The worst off still earn 25% more than 50 years ago, adjusted for inflation. Nobody is worse off, everybody is better off. This is without taking into account the rise in state distributions in those 50 years and the general increase in new goods/tech available and drop in prices for many of goods.

That's one thing. The system works. Vastly more wealth is created and everybody does get richer.

It also show, however, that inequality is a huge problem. Since the 80s (neolib revolution, massive tax breaks and trade really started taking off), the gains have gone grossly disproportionately to the top. Note -again- that that doesn't mean the middle or poor are worse off (they are, again, better off) but it is unfair to have such a skewing of income growth towards the top. This will only get worse with increased automation.

Moral of the story: continue with the wealth creation (by continuing to increase specialization and tech advances), but redistribute much more. Nobody is worse off, but inequality will just get worse and ultimately that is untenable. Society should continue to get richer on the aggregate, but needs to pump money back massively into education, healthcare, infrastructure and even no stigma attached checks/income top offs. As aggregate wealth increases, everybody should get a decent cut. But, fundamentally, people aren't better off poorer but more equal. Absolute terms is more important than relative terms. So, we shouldn't be in "the system is broke, change everything" panic mode. We should be in "hey man, your piece of the pie is unduly big -share more dude" mode.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1014 by chicpea » Thu Nov 08, 2018 7:52 pm

shredz [Bot] wrote:




I'm a huge Rosa Brooks fan. She can be quite dark at times.

Anyway, you guys better keep this thread good or there will be bood.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1015 by AD » Thu Nov 08, 2018 7:56 pm

So the poor are getting relatively poorer every year.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1016 by AD » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:03 pm

And the 4th quintile is particularly getting fucked with the 5th and 3rd following along closely behind in the relative hellscape.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1017 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:04 pm

AD wrote:So the poor are getting relatively poorer every year.


yes, the gap between the top and the rest is increasing, but everybody is getting richer (after inflation). This is not complicated.

The reason why this is pertinent is the system (trade + tech in a market economy) works, but it requires redistributive measures which should increase in lockstep with aggregate wealth. We're not better off reversing trade and automation and witness declines in real terms but with relative spreads flattening.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1018 by AD » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:05 pm

And we have had less and less redistribution in the last 5 decades.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1019 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:07 pm

AD wrote:And the 4th quintile is particularly getting fucked with the 5th and 3rd following along closely behind in the relative hellscape.


Yes, if "hellscape" is defined in real income growth and increased social redistributive measures. Basically, if "hellscape" is defined as "best it's ever been", but not as good as others.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1020 by AD » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:09 pm

[Dog]Its good that the uber rich get to buy blood from poor young people to keep feeling young especially before the uber rich embark on touristic space travel because people in Northern Angola have a toilet in the village now! See, everyone is better off! Huzzah for the free market![/Dog]
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1021 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:10 pm

AD wrote:And we have had less and less redistribution in the last 5 decades.


Nope.

And the numbers I posted are for the US. Things are actually considerably better in Canada, Western Europe and other not too crazy countries.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1022 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:13 pm

AD wrote:[Dog]Its good that the uber rich get to buy blood from poor young people to keep feeling young especially before the uber rich embark on touristic space travel because people in Northern Angola have a toilet in the village now! See, everyone is better off! Huzzah for the free market![/Dog]


You serious? I think I've been pretty clear. two nuanced things can be true side by side!

1. real income is up across the board, no demographic is worse off today than in the past

2. however, income growth has grossly disproportionately gone to the top and that calls for greater redistributive measures and not for reversing trade and automation which would just make everybody poorer (but more equal).
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1023 by AD » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:16 pm

No one is disputing 1. We're saying 2 is a huge problem and we need to fix it. You're saying 2. is a huge problem but because of 1. *shrugs* let's just see how things play out.

What in my Angola quote is a misrepresentation of your position?
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1024 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:17 pm

and, the real kicker, is that the biggest winners have been inhabitants of developing countries. Wealth gap, internationally, is flattening. That's a good thing. A human is a human. Solidarity shouldn't end within your ethnicity/state.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1025 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:18 pm

AD wrote:No one is disputing 1. We're saying 2 is a huge problem and we need to fix it. You're saying 2. is a huge problem but because of 1. *shrugs* let's just see how things play out.


of course not.

I'm saying the solution isn't to undo trade/automation, it's to redistribute. That's literally all I've been saying, over and over. With many words. Many, many words.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1026 by AD » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:21 pm

No one is arguing against that. We love technology and trade to a certain extent.

Point is, the advances created by the market mechanisms you are trying to protect are also the cause of the disparity and lack of redistribution.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1027 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:25 pm

AD wrote:No one is arguing against that. We love technology and trade to a certain extent.

Point is, the advances created by the market mechanisms you are trying to protect are also the cause of the disparity and lack of redistribution.


Misère, the initial post was in response to nick's bring back manufacturing to Murka.

And yes, it causes increased inequality. I've stated that from the first post and keep harping at it for years now. BUT, it also is the driver for increased wealth. Wealth is mainly specialization/productivity and innovation. It's gone global and it's increasing exponentially. That's fantastic. We need more aggregate wealth, not less! But, because of the unequal manner in which it is distributed, we need increases in redistributive measures. All this is about not throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Poorer but more equal is not the answer. I prefer richer and more equal!
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1028 by AD » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:26 pm

Relative wealth is important Dog. Doux jésus. It's more important than absolute wealth.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1029 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:29 pm

AD wrote:Relative wealth is important Dog. Doux jésus.


It is! Not as much as absolute wealth, though.

In terms of preferences:

1. poorer but more equal (undoing trade/automation)
2. richer but less equal (status quo)
3. richer but more equal (trade/automation + strong redistributive measures).
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1030 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:30 pm

AD wrote:It's more important than absolute wealth.


wait, what???!

You rather be poorer as long as your neighbour is less more rich than you? How does that make sense?
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1031 by AD » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:32 pm

Humans are happier all living in trees than having 1 person in a mansion and everyone else in mud huts.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1032 by Craig » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:47 pm

Oh sure, now ad comes out against houses.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1033 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:54 pm

AD wrote:Humans are happier all living in trees than having 1 person in a mansion and everyone else in mud huts.


Well then, tell poor people they should pay more for stuff because made in Murka and tell the developping world to suck it bwcause middle man wants a well paying manufacturing job.

Seriously, I don’t think that’s true, at least outside of pettiness. What I think people look for is fairness. They will tolerate inequality if they think that is fair. Of course this level of inequality is not at all fair. Hence why I have it as the defining problem of our times, after climate change. It then becomes a question of finding the best solution. That is not in reducing aggregate wealth, making poor people poorer and reducing the enormous gains of the developping world. It’s in taking what works and sharing the fruits more equally.

Fundamentally, specialization is at the root of economic growth as is innovation. You don’t reduce that and make everybody worse. You take those gains and spread the love more.

I think we are likely on the verge of a revolution in production that will dwarf the effects of trade. Machines are looking set to explode in terms of what they can do -cheaper and better than humans. That’s fantastic. Much more stuff, much better stuff, much cheaper. And not just crap, but essential goods and services too. The world has exponentially grown in plenty and that will likely accelerate. It’s a good place to be. What we need to do urgently is ensure boon is spead and not monopolized. Not break the machines so wverybody goes back to live on trees -which will be unequal in any event.

It’s a great story. We become exponentially better off when we learn to cooperate and share. And it can’t be done by central planning -too much loss of efficiency. It has to be voluntary -a grand bargain. Maybe we just need to kill off people that think relative wealth is more important than absolute wealth....

:danson:
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1034 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:55 pm

Craig wrote:Oh sure, now ad comes out against houses.


He’s developped a housing complex lately. Houses suck, AD! Well, except for the shelter and comfort and stuff. Those are pretty ace.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1035 by Slick Nick » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:01 pm

Dog wrote:
Slick Nick wrote:
Dog wrote:
:why:

Nuance, friend.

What I’m saying: « things aren’t perfect, but the overwhelming trend in the last few centuries -especially the past decades- is towards spectacular improvement. So, let’s look at why. What works? I think the motor is specialization and innovation. So, let’s not kill that while we work to solve the remaining problems. »

What you’re saying: « people are hurting...arrrrghhhhhh...break stuff!!! »

:crossarms:


I'm mostly saying stop treating them like human garbage and losers (deplorables) that only have their own inadequacies to blame, and actually do something to improve their living conditions... and in order to do that, you first have to acknowledge what the real problem is (economy, stagnating wages, inequalities) and it is not (identity politics).


The real problem, nick, is higher level than that. Those are symptoms. What’s going on is that we are in accelerating economic transition to a post industrial and increasingly post (certain) services economy. And that is good. That is great! That is more wealth (which is something that is created by efficiency and innovation) and better living conditions. What it does though is have side effects. Those effects include making less skilled / non human relations jobs increasingly more expandable. Manufacturing has largely gone. The next wave will be largely technology driven. The biggest occupation for males in the US is driving things. That’s going to disappear by in large in the next years. Most clerical white color office jobs will as well. We certainly are in times of transition and we certainly have to get ahead of the curve and minimize impacts -hence why I’ve been harping about redistributive policies and have shifted pretty solidly to center left. What we don’t need to do is lose our minds and bite the hand that feeds you. The solution isn’t to revert to a pre-trade / pre-technological society. That would basically kill all human progress of the past decades/centuries. Seriously, in this thread, the initial post I replied to had you wanting to make shit in Murka. From a humanity perspective, how do you justify prioritizing working class americans (which, all things considered have it significantly better than most people in developing countries) above chinamens or vietnamese or africans? From an internal fairness perspective, how do you justify making everybody pay more for the thing (which will include millions and millions of poorer people) to give that guy a salary. It’s stupid. It’s basically a « give Bob money tax ».

These things need to be much more rational and universal in application. They also need to not be counter-productive and actually lower living conditioms and undo progress.

Moral outrage is fun, but the real worth is in actually solving things and that requires a cool head and measured approach -not a mindless sledgehammer because emotions!


We have very different views of progress and the world, but that's not new.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1036 by Slick Nick » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:13 pm

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You can win a million at the loto and still can't afford a 2 bedroom condo in most of the bigger cities with job opportunities....But you can get a freaking 60inch TV for 399$!!!
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1037 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:30 pm

Slick Nick wrote:Image


Hey look, here’s the inflation adjusted graph, from the same site:

Image

The very site basically contradicts what you were intending.

The other two graphs are not surprising.

US tuition costs are nuts and completelt out of whack.

There is an opioid problem in the last decade.

Now:

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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1038 by Dog » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:35 pm

Basically, just visit that website (Our World in Data). It is bursting with absolutely fantastic news you never hear about because the news is sensationalist and short term.

I’ll repeat, growing income inequality is a big problem in the West, but overall the world is not going to hell. It will only go to hell if we make it by being stupid. The trends are almost all very favorable (if not downright miraculous in many cases, especially at the international level). Have to address climate change or else it’s all for naught. Have to push heavily for greater redistribution from the top.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1039 by PredsFan77 » Fri Nov 09, 2018 3:23 am

Hey all these graphs just broke the Frankfurt Airport WiFi. Hope yall are proud of yourselves.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1040 by Dog » Fri Nov 09, 2018 7:10 am

It was a graph-off, predo. Graph til you drop.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1041 by mayoradamwest » Fri Nov 09, 2018 7:46 am

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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1042 by shredz » Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:52 am

PredsFan77 wrote:Hey all these graphs just broke the Frankfurt Airport WiFi. Hope yall are proud of yourselves.



Gotta make NATO pay some how. :trump:
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1043 by shredz » Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:07 am

This chick is perfect for you #AD (shes cute)

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and then here's the host, Craiggersan

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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1044 by Craig » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:01 am

This graph is interesting to me. I wonder how it compares to net GDP.

https://ourworldindata.org/wp-content/u ... ncomes.png

In other words, is it that the English countries are growing faster than everyone else, but that growth is going to the rich? Or is it that they're growing about the same and the rich are taking more of that growth than in other countries? Is the median guy getting a worse deal not relative to the rich in his country, but his peers in others?

Also interesting that Germany just isn't on the chart. I suspect it breaks the mould.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1045 by Dog » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:10 am

That was one of my favs too. Anglo countries show up in other graphs as having less social spending/taxes than continental euro countries as well. I’d think that’s the reason, but yeah the interesting tidbit as you say would be to compre that with GDP per capita. Always got the feeling that there is an « efficiency threshold » where you « optimally » balance growth with redistribution.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1046 by shredz » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:11 am

Craig wrote:This graph is interesting to me. I wonder how it compares to net GDP.

https://ourworldindata.org/wp-content/u ... ncomes.png

In other words, is it that the English countries are growing faster than everyone else, but that growth is going to the rich? Or is it that they're growing about the same and the rich are taking more of that growth than in other countries? Is the median guy getting a worse deal not relative to the rich in his country, but his peers in others?

Also interesting that Germany just isn't on the chart. I suspect it breaks the mould.


Are those giant spikes upwards around 1915-1930s due to the First World War or the Depression?

That's quite the drop for Denmark over time. Netherlands too.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1047 by Dog » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:14 am

shredz [Bot] wrote:
Craig wrote:This graph is interesting to me. I wonder how it compares to net GDP.

https://ourworldindata.org/wp-content/u ... ncomes.png

In other words, is it that the English countries are growing faster than everyone else, but that growth is going to the rich? Or is it that they're growing about the same and the rich are taking more of that growth than in other countries? Is the median guy getting a worse deal not relative to the rich in his country, but his peers in others?

Also interesting that Germany just isn't on the chart. I suspect it breaks the mould.


Are those giant spikes upwards around 1915-1930s due to the First World War or the Depression?

That's quite the drop for Denmark over time. Netherlands too.


I actually think it’s more the dips are caused by widespread destruction post world wars. More equal because everybody is poor.

Of course in those charts, the anglo countries (especially the US) reverted to inequality and continental eurp stayed much more flat.

I think it just goes to having to increase social redistributions in lock step with aggregate wealth.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1048 by Dog » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:17 am

Look at how inequality dipped in Spain post 2008ish. Not for good reasons, though.
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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1049 by shredz » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:20 am

Dog wrote:
shredz [Bot] wrote:
Craig wrote:This graph is interesting to me. I wonder how it compares to net GDP.

https://ourworldindata.org/wp-content/u ... ncomes.png

In other words, is it that the English countries are growing faster than everyone else, but that growth is going to the rich? Or is it that they're growing about the same and the rich are taking more of that growth than in other countries? Is the median guy getting a worse deal not relative to the rich in his country, but his peers in others?

Also interesting that Germany just isn't on the chart. I suspect it breaks the mould.


Are those giant spikes upwards around 1915-1930s due to the First World War or the Depression?

That's quite the drop for Denmark over time. Netherlands too.


I actually think it’s more the dips are caused by widespread destruction post world wars. More equal because everybody is poor.

Of course in those charts, the anglo countries (especially the US) reverted to inequality and continental eurp stayed much more flat.

I think it just goes to having to increase social redistributions in lock step with aggregate wealth.


Canada is almost in perfect lock step with US (albeit on a smaller scale) but this stood out about 1920.

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Re: The Real Murka: Fuck You Thread

Post #1050 by Dog » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:24 am


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