Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

..et d'autres discussions ennuyeuses
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4701 by chicpea » Mon Oct 01, 2018 1:58 am

USMCA. Ch 19. H2O starring Paul Gross
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4702 by Dog » Mon Oct 01, 2018 8:33 am

Cause huge international blowouts and rip appart your deepest alliances to get relatively minor tweaks to existing deals.

-the art of the deal
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4703 by senate » Mon Oct 01, 2018 8:52 am

I'm curious to see how NAFTA 2.0 is going to get through Congress. Unless the Republicans can ram it through in the lame duck session, I think there is a good chance that we will have to come back and negotiate NAFTA 2.1 in 2020.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4704 by chicpea » Mon Oct 01, 2018 9:48 am

I’m off to work. I’m going to require several takes on this throughout the day so please keep this thread scorching hot.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4705 by senate » Mon Oct 01, 2018 9:59 am

Looks like American Super Bowl commercials are going away. Under NAFTA 2, Canada can not exclude specific programs from simultaneous substitution.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4706 by Dog » Mon Oct 01, 2018 11:34 am

senate wrote:Looks like American Super Bowl commercials are going away. Under NAFTA 2, Canada can not exclude specific programs from simultaneous substitution.


I knew we’d get screwed in the end.

:why:
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4707 by mayoradamwest » Mon Oct 01, 2018 11:59 am

Yay, we changed the name!
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4708 by shredz » Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:10 am

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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4709 by mayoradamwest » Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:33 am

The TPP we just signed to update NAFTA is decent. :dunno:
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4710 by shredz » Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:52 am

mayoradamwest wrote:The TPP we just signed to update NAFTA is decent. :dunno:


You mean the AMERICA-Mexico-Canada treatise?
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4711 by PredsFan77 » Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:34 pm

happy thanksgiving, someone just blew up your largest refinery.
CDX.NA.IG.9









[LEFT]Image[/LEFT]
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4712 by chicpea » Mon Oct 08, 2018 4:11 pm

We have too many refineries anyway. Everything is quite refined here. It's basically like that movie The Crown but in the 14th Century and every citizen has corgis which they are given at birth.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4713 by mcphee » Mon Oct 08, 2018 5:35 pm

chicpea wrote:We have too many refineries anyway. Everything is quite refined here. It's basically like that movie The Crown but in the 14th Century and every citizen has corgis which they are given at birth.

a poorly thought out tradition as the lifespan of the corgi means that most Canadians approach puberty depressed over their dead dogs
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4714 by Dr_Chimera » Tue Oct 09, 2018 10:55 pm

Thread:



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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4715 by Dog » Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:52 am

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/nation ... -1.4855353

Still don’t know how I feel about this. Like not from a is the Trudeau admin grandstanding or being legit point of view (who cares), but from a strategy point of view. Is isolation the best approach to opening up a regime or is a longer term cooperative approach more effective. I think it’s probably a mix. Carrot and stick type of thing. That said, Western Govs are far too much in bed with the Saudi Royals for commercial reasons. That said, what’s the alternative? They are likely moderates compared to the theocracy that would most likely emerge. That said, did the arabs need to go through arab spring adolescence and chaos to long term come off better (even with short term pain/regressing).

Not too sure on which foot to dance on these things. Tempted to say you are patient and work with them as long as you are seeing progress and if not, pull back. And if you are primarily acting out of greed, then go shoot yourself.

Kinda sticking with the Trudeau admin on this.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4716 by Shawnathan Horcoff » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:51 am

Fuck Arabistan.

And that’s the final word.
Also, let's keep this thread about Galchenyuk's on-ice performance, development and value and NOT bring in his personal life or race.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4717 by Dog » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:53 am

Okey dokey. Thanks, _dong!
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4718 by shredz » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:59 am

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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4719 by Dr_Chimera » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:45 pm

I think Horak is probably correct in his criticisms of Canada's twitter diplomacy. If they wish to maintain a friendly relationship with the Saudis then it seems awfully hypocritical to chastise them on social media while simultaneously engaging in weapons trading and keeping silent on the Saudi war in Yemen.

Either you reject their awfulness outright or tread very carefully. And Canada will never do the former unless the US does it first.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4720 by Dr_Chimera » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:51 pm

Dog wrote:https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/national-dennis-horak-ambassador-saudi-arabia-interview-1.4855353

Still don’t know how I feel about this. Like not from a is the Trudeau admin grandstanding or being legit point of view (who cares), but from a strategy point of view. Is isolation the best approach to opening up a regime or is a longer term cooperative approach more effective. I think it’s probably a mix. Carrot and stick type of thing. That said, Western Govs are far too much in bed with the Saudi Royals for commercial reasons. That said, what’s the alternative? They are likely moderates compared to the theocracy that would most likely emerge. That said, did the arabs need to go through arab spring adolescence and chaos to long term come off better (even with short term pain/regressing).

Not too sure on which foot to dance on these things. Tempted to say you are patient and work with them as long as you are seeing progress and if not, pull back. And if you are primarily acting out of greed, then go shoot yourself.

Kinda sticking with the Trudeau admin on this.


Making incremental progress with billion-dollar weapons deals.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4721 by Dog » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:59 pm

Dr_Chimera wrote:I think Horak is probably correct in his criticisms of Canada's twitter diplomacy. If they wish to maintain a friendly relationship with the Saudis then it seems awfully hypocritical to chastise them on social media while simultaneously engaging in weapons trading and keeping silent on the Saudi war in Yemen.

Either you reject their awfulness outright or tread very carefully. And Canada will never do the former unless the US does it first.


The motives are kinda secondary, I think. It’s more the resultant policy that interests me. Like, in the abstract -what’s the best strategic approach. The admin was likely grandstanding some -but they were also pushing it further than most/all. They tweeted the thing in arabic, which seems to be what really ticked off the Sauds (« they are directly inciting our people », kinda thing). Sauds wanna keep firm control over social developments, Ottawa went too far, in their eyes, by directly tweeting in arabic. They, probably rightly, saw it as an attack on their internal authority. Words and form matter, especially in diplomacy. It wasn’t « we condemn » which would have been fine. It was « do this now »....in arabic, in a public forum.

Whether they realized it or not (I think they did, Freeland at least), they were pushing the envelope. Made it a question of principle and were agressive in sending out the message. I’m purely wondering if that (which immediately leads to cutting communication channels) is wiser than staying at the table. I guess if the person at the table is not listening to you, is there any reason to stay? At that point walking out is probably best.

And yes, they’d still take their money and sell them arms. Rather, they would not go out of their way to scuttle it. They welcomed it. Politics. Jerbs. Money. Pragmatism. Not your ideal, but that’s not the sole standard to judge actions in the world.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4722 by senate » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:59 pm

The poor CBC really mistimed their story. Any outrage discussion they thought they'd generate has been drowned out by the Khashoggi assassination.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4723 by Dr_Chimera » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:03 pm

Dog wrote:And yes, they’d still take their money and sell them arms. Rather, they would not go out of their way to scuttle it. They welcomed it. Politics. Jerbs. Money. Pragmatism. Not your ideal, but that’s not the sole standard to judge actions in the world.


Not following you here.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4724 by Dog » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:17 pm

Dr_Chimera wrote:
Dog wrote:And yes, they’d still take their money and sell them arms. Rather, they would not go out of their way to scuttle it. They welcomed it. Politics. Jerbs. Money. Pragmatism. Not your ideal, but that’s not the sole standard to judge actions in the world.


Not following you here.


Freeland/foreign affairs can lead from a more principled position and not imply that the whole Canadian government has to be fully coherent behind that and turn down $15B deals. In a perfect world, you’d want full coherence accross the board. In this world, the fact they don’t go as far as to scuttle $15B deals doesn’t mean their arabic tweets were empty headed measures. Both can certainly be true. A Freeland led department can lead from a more courageous and principled approach while other ministers remain more pragmatic.

I don’t think this is necessarily insignificant. Buddy Saud is laughing now with Trump as his best bud and the UK being utter whores, but Germany, Sweden and other EU states appear closer to Canada and actually close to putting principles above commercial interests -at least with SA. Get progressives in the WH and Downing street in a couple years and the tide could have violently turned on buddy Saud.

Canada set a precedent here with SA and SA had very little leverage to push back. As oil dependency goes down, yeah i’d be more worried being them than us long term in this little feud.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4725 by Dr_Chimera » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:21 pm

Dog wrote:Freeland/foreign affairs can lead from a more principled position and not imply that the whole Canadian government has to be fully coherent behind that and turn down $15B deals. In a perfect world, you’d want full coherence accross the board. In this world, the fact they don’t go as far as to scuttle $15B deals doesn’t mean their arabic tweets were empty headed measures.


I don't know what your definition of "principled position" is, but it is obviously not the same as mine. Signing billion-dollar deals with dictatorships that fund wars of aggression is morally wrong. The Trudeau liberals cannot offer a strong moral vision while at the same time profiting from these deals and downplaying their involvement in them.

The Trudeau liberals want Canada to look clean while at the same time getting their hands dirty.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4726 by Dog » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:52 pm

I think I clearly distinguished as a « principled position » the stance on the Badawis from foreign affairs as opposed to the less principled position, from other parts of the gov, to not flush a $15B deal to make a point. If you don’t want to make that distinction and paint everything with the same moral outrage brush, that’s fine. I can sorta hold the two thoughts in my mind « hey, Freeland took a principled stance on this even if the government as a whole didn’t go so far as to scuttle a $15B order ».
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4727 by Dr_Chimera » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:32 pm

Dog wrote:I think I clearly distinguished as a « principled position » the stance on the Badawis from foreign affairs as opposed to the less principled position, from other parts of the gov, to not flush a $15B deal to make a point. If you don’t want to make that distinction and paint everything with the same moral outrage brush, that’s fine. I can sorta hold the two thoughts in my mind « hey, Freeland took a principled stance on this even if the government as a whole didn’t go so far as to scuttle a $15B order ».


The Trudeau liberals took the Badawi stance because they believed that it wouldn't cost them anything and it turned out that they were wrong. They like making empty gestures in order to flatter themselves.

Cancelling the arms deal would actually cost us a lot, economically-speaking, but this is where the test of one's true moral courage is on display. This is where one cannot simply style themselves as a champion of human rights, because either you are or you aren't.

Canada has been on record saying that they will stop the export of military goods to the Saudis if "there is a reasonable risk of human rights abuses." But they have shown no real commitment to doing so and have ignored many facts that demonstrate that human rights abuses have been committed with the use of their weapons.

Anthony Fenton, an academic who follows Canada’s arms exports to the Middle East, uses local reports and photos posted to social media to track the use of Canadian weapons in Yemen. Many of the images come from the military itself — what Fenton calls “Saudi selfies” — and appear to show Canadian equipment being used by the Saudis or Emirates on Yemen’s border or within its towns. Though they are difficult to verify, the sheer number of sightings posted by civilians or players on all sides of the conflict provide a damning body of evidence, according to Fenton.

“There is not a shred of doubt Canadian equipment is being used in Yemen,” he said. “We track this on a daily basis and there hasn’t been a week since this war began that there hasn’t been some sighting of Canadian goods being used.”


Freeland’s spokesperson said if the government had evidence a Canadian-exported weapon was being deployed other than for its “authorized end use,” Freeland would cancel future export permits associated with the sale. But how does Ottawa monitor weapons once they’re in the hands of another country? Global Affairs did not answer.

Fenton said he didn’t think Canadian officials did “much of anything” to monitor Canadian weapons after they’re sold. “What could they do? They’d have to have personnel embedded with the military with a notepad. The point is they shouldn’t be sold in the first place,” he said.


Source: https://www.thestar.com/news/investigat ... untry.html

The fact that you refer to these sales, and their economic benefit to Canada, as "pragmatic" says a lot about you and other people who are willing to place a lot of distance between themselves and the consequences of their actions.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4728 by Dog » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:59 pm

Why did they tweet it in arabic with directive language, outside of what’s the normally acceptable diplomatic space for Western countries to criticize SA « for show »? Think maybe they were willing to go futher than just about anybody else?

....but maybe not to the point of cancelling a pre-made $15B order?

I mean, I get that you are an all or nothing type but it seems like there is room for nuance. Not everything is all angels or all demons, man.

And, I, Dog, didn’t sell weapons to the Saudis. So, again, there is probably little need for the high horse there. I called not cancelling the deal « pragmatic » (as opposed to principled) which is exactly what it was. (ie. am I really going to shot myself in the foot and cancel an already announced order if they can just as easily fill this order from elsewhere...). That’s pragmatic, which doesn’t mean it’s right.

The tweets in arabic with directive language could be a principled decision -a willingness to go further than the « safe language » other governments use....and that doesn’t mean the Trudeau gov is completely or even mostly principled in its actions. Personally, I would have liked to have seen the SA order cancelled and the pipelines nixed. I agree that they are, to a large extent, putting on a beauty pageant as the world’s enlightened liberals. Their actions fall far short of their rhetoric. Agreed. That is not what I’m saying, though. I’m saying foreign affairs likely consciously decided to be bold and push the limits of « acceptable diplomacy » by tweeting in arabic with directive language. That may be small potatoes, but it’s still more potatoes than what any other western gov was willing to do. And, much as you may hate it, incremental progress can have effect even if it comes from a place of concession and less than idealistic action.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4729 by Dog » Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:03 pm

It is kinda amazing. I posted a story on the Canadian SA ambassador saying foreign affairs went too far -a position at least implicitly shared by all other allies as none publicly supported Canada. As in, the quasi-whole diplomatic community thought it pushed the envelope and/or went too far.

Anticipated you would jump in and not stand the discussion because of the arms deal. I tried to separate the two from the get go in order to simply discuss the merits of the diplomatic position. And it leads to, predictably....
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4730 by Dr_Chimera » Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:15 pm

Dog wrote:I’m saying foreign affairs likely consciously decided to be bold and push the limits of « acceptable diplomacy » by tweeting in arabic with directive language. That may be small potatoes, but it’s still more potatoes than what any other western gov was willing to do. And, much as you may hate it, incremental progress can have effect even if it comes from a place of concession and less than idealistic action.


Actually this is far less than what other Western governments have been willing to do. If you'd read the article I've just posted you would see that European countries are enforcing embargoes against the Saudis and ending their past practices of arms sales:

The European Parliament passed a non-binding resolution in 2016 calling on all member states to enforce an arms embargo against Saudi Arabia for its role in Yemen. The Netherlands was first to take up the call. Finland and Norway have since stopped selling weapons to the United Arab Emirates. Earlier this year, Germany declared an end to arms sales to all parties involved in Yemen’s war.


Canada is becoming isolated, along with UK and the US, in being among those still willing to sell weapons to the Saudis for their murderous wars. You see pragmatism and incremental progress. I am seeing Canada falling behind international human rights standards. Still pretending to be leading the way, but actually - excuse me, pragmatically - scraping the bottom of the barrel.

And yes, we are all involved. You didn't personally sell these weapons to the Saudis, nor did I. But we are Canadian citizens and it matters what we do and say about this right now. "Incremental progress" isn't it.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4731 by Dog » Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:23 pm

Had read earlier that Germany was considering stopping future arms deals with SA, not that they had voluntarily cancelled prior deals. I doubt the Can gov goes out now, even if a « reconciliation » happens, and re-commits to an arms deal with SA. Germany certainly didn’t have any qualms selling arms to SA until quite recently as well. The $15B order was made under Harper. I seriously doubt Merkle would have voluntarily cancelled an existing and announced order.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4732 by Dr_Chimera » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:14 pm

In the new USMCA, Canada cannot sign trade deals with any "non market" economy (e.g., China) without America's permission. If you believe that China is the next great economic power, this might hurt us in the future.

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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4733 by senate » Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:31 am

If America wants to have a hissy fit and cancel NAFTA 2 because Canada or Mexico entered a trade deal with China then America will do it whether there is a clause in NAFTA 2 that allowed it or not. Section 32.10 is a meaningless "win" for America because it is just a statement of reality.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4734 by mayoradamwest » Sat Oct 13, 2018 7:18 pm

let's object to the TPP as we transform NAFTA into the TPP....
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4735 by Shawnathan Horcoff » Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:19 am

Lose your illusions. It's an ugly, dystopian world. Image

A few thoughts on the Republic of Dystopia, our southern neighbour, and the Kingdom of Draconia, Canada's most violent and temperamental weapons customer.

A second man credibly accused of sexual misconduct now sits on the Supreme Court of the United States. The story is over, and Americans quickly moved on. As they do.

Ultimately, all Christine Blasey Ford — the woman who alleged Brett Kavanaugh sexually assaulted her back in high school — received for her rather courageous decision to testify on live television was cruel ridicule from her savage, braying president, and guffaws from the simple-minded flying monkeys he commands at his rallies.

Her testimony never had a chance of changing anything, as she herself acknowledged early in the process. Anyone who thinks the outcome could have been different should take a moment and read a NPR/PBS Newshour/Marist poll taken late last month. It received far too little attention.

Marist pollsters asked approximately 1,000 men and women voters whether, "if the charge of sexual assault during a party in high school by Christine Blasey Ford against Brett Kavanaugh is true, do you think Brett Kavanaugh should be confirmed …?"

Fifty-four per cent of Republicans, 12 per cent of Democrats, and 31 per cent of independents said yes.

Think about that a moment. More than half the Republicans and significant factions of Democrats and independents were keen to see Kavanaugh confirmedeven if Ford's accusation was proven true. Put more bluntly, they would have been happy seeing a rapist (or attempted rapist) seated on the court. If Ford had shown up with video of the assault she says Kavanaugh inflicted on her back in his prep school days, it would have made no difference to them.

It's a stunning statistic, until you remember that millions of Americans voted for President Donald Trump, who was caught bragging on tape about committing sexual assault, and who stands accused by around 20 women.

Social justice advocates would say it's all got to do with the emboldenment of white male rage against loss of entitlement, and there's no doubt that motivation exists. There's a reason Trump portrays the #MeToo movement as a barrage of life-ruining false accusations against men.

But it's more than that. White women broke for Trump in 2016, and significant numbers of white women, with and without college educations, would have seated Kavanaugh even after seeing hard evidence of guilt, the Marist poll suggests.

As, too, would have almost half of the respondents who identified as white Evangelical Christians. Because, you know, better an anti-abortion sexual predator than a liberal baby murderer.

And then there's the motivation often planted by right-wing commentators under stories on news websites. They're basically for anything they think will "make liberals' heads explode." And their hero is the chief exploder. Thanks to them, Trump was able to wave off his own piggish admissions as "locker room talk." Had there been tape of Kavanaugh assaulting Ford, it would no doubt have been accepted as wacky locker room hijinks.

It's increasingly apparent Trump represents Americans better than any of his predecessors. I'm willing to bet his fellow Dystopians will elect him to a second term.

But sexual assault isn't the only crime met with a shrug from the highest echelons of the United States. Cold-blooded murder is fine, too, as long as the perpetrators are willing to buy American.

It's becoming pretty clear that the crazed princeling of Draconia, Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, likely dispatched a 15-man assassination squad with a bone saw to slaughter and carve up the bothersome expat journalist Jamal Khashoggi, who visited the theocracy's embassy in Turkey last month for marriage-related documents. There may actually be a recording of the execution; Turkish intelligence, the regime in Ankara is suggesting to journalists, has a copy.

Khashoggi was an American resident and wrote for the Washington Post, among other outlets, criticizing the Saudi regime.

Such criticism clearly drives Prince Mohammed nuts, as Canada discovered last summer, when he decreed a series of sanctions against Canada in reply to a relatively mild expression of concern by our foreign affairs minister about his family's human rights record.

As it turns out, U.S. intelligence agents intercepted Saudi discussions about abducting Khashoggi, but reportedly said nothing, just as Donald Trump, who professes great affection for the crown prince and his family, has said just about nothing, other than to remark, after speaking with the Saudi king, that it might have been "rogue killers," and to assure reporters the Saudi monarch "flatly denies" executing Khashoggi, in much the same way as Trump rushed to accept President Vladimir Putin's flat denial that Russia meddled in the 2016 American election.

(To be fair to Trump, the United States has a history of generosity and offering the benefit of doubt where the Saudis are concerned . Remember, the U.S. government, even as it rounded up thousands of innocent Muslims living on American soil in the days after the 9/11 attacks, and contemplated attacking Iraq in retaliation, allowed the family of Osama Bin Laden — who actually directed the team of mostly Saudi extremists who carried out the attacks — to fly back to sanctuary in Saudi within days of the attack as the Twin Towers lay in smoking ruins).

Should the United States curtail shipment of American weapons to the Saudis — weapons that the Saudis then use to slaughter civilians wholesale in Yemen?

Absolutely not, says Trump, at whose hotels the Saudis spend lavishly. Besides, Khashoggi wasn't an American citizen, he adds. No doubt the White House is trying to figure out some way to blame all this on Iran.

But it's not Iran, it's America's closest Arab pals. The same bunch Canadian Foreign Affairs Minister Chrystia Freeland surely wants to flatter back into a fond relationship here. Canada sells the Saudis billions in weapons systems too, after all, and we need those medical residents Mohammed bin Salman threatened to yank from our underfunded hospitals.

People my age grew up believing the world, led by the West, was becoming ever more progressive. It wasn't, and it isn't. All it took was one ambitious real estate huckster to dispel the illusion.
Also, let's keep this thread about Galchenyuk's on-ice performance, development and value and NOT bring in his personal life or race.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4736 by Dog » Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:31 am

Where some see dystopia, others see unraveling. This shit is not sustainable, as more and more are undoubtedly realizing.

That said, have to be careful not to get dogmatic in the opposing side either. It does make sense that actions 30+ years ago do not automatically disqualify someone. Depends what he’s learned and where he is at now. His testimony in front of the Senate disqualified him, not solely his long ago acts.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4737 by AD » Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:36 am

"Actions".. you mean potential criminality?

The poll was presuming that the criminal behaviour was assumed true, would that disqualify him.

It would disqualify him as a lawyer, and judge, let alone to be confirmed on the Supreme Court.

Give your head a shake, dog.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4738 by Dog » Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:40 am

AD wrote:"Actions".. you mean potential criminality?

The poll was presuming that the criminal behaviour was assumed true, would that disqualify him.

It would disqualify him as a lawyer, and judge, let alone to be confirmed on the Supreme Court.

Give your head a shake, dog.


It doesn’t...automatically. Not if he fesses up and eventually gets pardoned.

That poll is in hypothetical land. “Does a crime 30 years ago automatically disqualify you”. I think the answer to that should be no, you have to also look at what’s happened since.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4739 by AD » Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:52 am

Dog wrote:
AD wrote:"Actions".. you mean potential criminality?

The poll was presuming that the criminal behaviour was assumed true, would that disqualify him.

It would disqualify him as a lawyer, and judge, let alone to be confirmed on the Supreme Court.

Give your head a shake, dog.


It doesn’t...automatically. Not if he fesses up and eventually gets pardoned.

That poll is in hypothetical land. “Does a crime 30 years ago automatically disqualify you”. I think the answer to that should be no, you have to also look at what’s happened since.


The poll wasn't. Look at the question: Are the charges by Ford... i.e., rape.

Rape dog.

Rape disqualifies you from being one of the 9 most important judges in the biggest justice system in the world. Yes.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4740 by Dog » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:01 pm

AD wrote:
Dog wrote:
AD wrote:"Actions".. you mean potential criminality?

The poll was presuming that the criminal behaviour was assumed true, would that disqualify him.

It would disqualify him as a lawyer, and judge, let alone to be confirmed on the Supreme Court.

Give your head a shake, dog.


It doesn’t...automatically. Not if he fesses up and eventually gets pardoned.

That poll is in hypothetical land. “Does a crime 30 years ago automatically disqualify you”. I think the answer to that should be no, you have to also look at what’s happened since.


The poll wasn't. Look at the question: Are the charges by Ford... i.e., rape.

Rape dog.

Rape disqualifies you from being one of the 9 most important judges in the biggest justice system in the world. Yes.


Didn't you have a dude that killed his parents as a confrère?

I’m not defending Kavanaugh, nor Thailand boi for that matter. All I’m saying is that someone’s distant past isn’t end all be all -you also have to look at what’s happened since.

Let’s go into alternative reality. Young bro boi Kavanaugh almost raped somebody while in high school. The incident passed without accusations and whatnot. In the meantime, he’s grown considerably. Has nothing in common with young bro boi anymore, as shown by his life’s work. He gets nominated for scotus. Accusations come out. He earnestly and unconditionally apologizes-even if he may have forgotten all about it.

Automatic disqualification?
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4741 by Craig » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:27 pm

Yes.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4742 by Dog » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:31 pm

Okey dokey, you’re the mod.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4743 by TittiesNBeer » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:33 pm

Yeah im on board with SCOTUS judges should never have committed attempted rape at any point in their lives.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4744 by Craig » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:33 pm

My reason for saying that isn't about bro boi or his potential performance as a SC justice. It's because of the message that sends to the public and other victims of sexual assault. Elevating someone like that to such a high and public position is a terrible message and a net drain on society. Go find someone else who hasn't raped.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4745 by Dog » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:36 pm

Craig wrote:My reason for saying that isn't about bro boi or his potential performance as a SC justice. It's because of the message that sends to the public and other victims of sexual assault. Elevating someone like that to such a high and public position is a terrible message and a net drain on society. Go find someone else who hasn't raped.


No kidding. That’s not what I was saying, though.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4746 by Craig » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:36 pm

? It's literally what you said.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4747 by Dog » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:37 pm

Is not.

:crossarms:
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4748 by shredz » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:38 pm

Dog wrote:Is not.

Image
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4749 by Dog » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:39 pm

shredz wrote:
Dog wrote:Is not.

Image


Dogs are like so cool.
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Re: Maybe a joke about Bill Morneau ... if not Greg

Post #4750 by AD » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:39 pm

Dog wrote:
AD wrote:
Dog wrote:
It doesn’t...automatically. Not if he fesses up and eventually gets pardoned.

That poll is in hypothetical land. “Does a crime 30 years ago automatically disqualify you”. I think the answer to that should be no, you have to also look at what’s happened since.


The poll wasn't. Look at the question: Are the charges by Ford... i.e., rape.

Rape dog.

Rape disqualifies you from being one of the 9 most important judges in the biggest justice system in the world. Yes.


Didn't you have a dude that killed his parents as a confrère?

I’m not defending Kavanaugh, nor Thailand boi for that matter. All I’m saying is that someone’s distant past isn’t end all be all -you also have to look at what’s happened since.

Let’s go into alternative reality. Young bro boi Kavanaugh almost raped somebody while in high school. The incident passed without accusations and whatnot. In the meantime, he’s grown considerably. Has nothing in common with young bro boi anymore, as shown by his life’s work. He gets nominated for scotus. Accusations come out. He earnestly and unconditionally apologizes-even if he may have forgotten all about it.

Automatic disqualification?


Of course. And it's not "almost rape". What was "almost" about this?

And having a confrère be admitted into the profession is not the same as being nominated to the highest court.

Dog? Are you ok?

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