Murrica: fuck yeah

..et d'autres discussions ennuyeuses
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jester
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11401 by jester » Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:55 pm

Dog wrote:In any event, it’s not like anybody would learn anything new by hearing Trump being a loudmouth racist/sexist. Everybody knows. Some mind, some don’t care, some rejoice.


I tend to agree the needle wouldn't move too much
... but to an extent it depends on the audio. If it's Trump just casually throwing around the n-word, I doubt there would be a huge impact. On the other hand, if it's Trump unequivocally saying racist shit and throwing it around, I suspect it would move a sliver of voters.

It seems to me that one of the defensive barriers against the "Trump is racist" accusation is that his (non-racist) defenders have a narrow understanding of racism. It needs to be really explicit before they'll grasp it.

I doubt we will ever hear that audio, though. Much more likely a Dem Congress will produce his tax returns.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11402 by mayoradamwest » Fri Aug 10, 2018 9:47 pm

Let's not try and apply logic here folks
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11403 by Shawnathan Horcoff » Fri Aug 10, 2018 10:21 pm

mayoradamwest wrote:Let's not try and apply logic here folks


The last man on Earth will still be assuring himself that humans couldn’t afford to deal with a changing society or climate. Image
Also, let's keep this thread about Galchenyuk's on-ice performance, development and value and NOT bring in his personal life or race.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11404 by Slick Nick » Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:49 am

jester wrote:It needs to be really explicit before they'll grasp it.


You mean like these?

Image
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11405 by mayoradamwest » Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:17 am

Man, not professional Twitter name too! :(
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11406 by shredz » Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:47 pm

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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11407 by jester » Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:57 pm

Slick Nick wrote:
jester wrote:It needs to be really explicit before they'll grasp it.


You mean like these?

Image


No, not parody/critique, actual racism. But I like you pushing the alt-right BS machine here. I mean, any time you can line yourself up with these assholes and the Gamergate crowd, ya gotta do it, right?
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11408 by Slick Nick » Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:04 pm

What exactly does posting fuck white people accomplish? Do you think it actually helps solving racism? Or is it the cool thing you now do to show how progressed you are?
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11409 by chicpea » Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:54 pm

The money trail, made public here for the first time, sheds new light on [Republican Peter]Smith’s effort, in which he told people he was in touch with both Russians on the dark web and Trump campaign officials — particularly Michael Flynn, who was then a top adviser to the Trump campaign and later served as national security adviser before having to resign after misleading White House officials about his meetings with the Russian ambassador to the United States.


https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/ja ... lynn-money

and listen in on lawfare's take here: http://traffic.libsyn.com/lawfare/Cormi ... -id=221919
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11410 by jester » Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:34 pm

Slick Nick wrote:What exactly does posting fuck white people accomplish? Do you think it actually helps solving racism? Or is it the cool thing you now do to show how progressed you are?


Why do you assume she was trying to "solve" racism. Look, I'm going to go out on a limb and assume that a) you're not new to the internet; b) have some awareness of internet culture; and c) have the ability to imagine the context surrounding an *Asian woman* covering the tech environment along with her social media presence. I'm also going to assume you understand the tactic of surfacing old social media postings and presenting them in a bad faith manner ...

Of course, as said, either you're cool with your allies on this one (literally the toxic cesspool of internet culture) or you're not. If you are, it is what it is ... alt-right and Gamergate d-bags serm like fun at parties. If you're not cool with that crowd (and what they're doing there), may need to think harder about the argument being made and *why* it is being made.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11411 by Slick Nick » Sat Aug 11, 2018 5:46 pm

jester wrote:
Slick Nick wrote:What exactly does posting fuck white people accomplish? Do you think it actually helps solving racism? Or is it the cool thing you now do to show how progressed you are?


Why do you assume she was trying to "solve" racism. Look, I'm going to go out on a limb and assume that a) you're not new to the internet; b) have some awareness of internet culture; and c) have the ability to imagine the context surrounding an *Asian woman* covering the tech environment along with her social media presence. I'm also going to assume you understand the tactic of surfacing old social media postings and presenting them in a bad faith manner ...

Of course, as said, either you're cool with your allies on this one (literally the toxic cesspool of internet culture) or you're not. If you are, it is what it is ... alt-right and Gamergate d-bags serm like fun at parties. If you're not cool with that crowd (and what they're doing there), may need to think harder about the argument being made and *why* it is being made.


I'm of the opinion that the left's propensity to racialise every aspect of life is only making things worse in the long run. And garbage like this should offend you as much as any racist garbage you hear from the fart-right, but somehow it doesn't and you even seem to caution this attitude.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11412 by PredsFan77 » Sat Aug 11, 2018 6:08 pm

Just need to do more barrel roles
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11413 by Dr_Chimera » Sat Aug 11, 2018 6:23 pm

I think even completely satire-free bitching about white people is fine in most contexts. How thin-skinned must one be to take offense?

One exception would be a scenario in which most white people die of white people disease and the remaining ones are heckled all the time and forced to shine shoes.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11414 by Dog » Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:17 pm

Are members of minorities racist? Absolutely, nobody would deny that. If there is more focus on racist acts from the majority, it’s first and foremost because their dominant position makes it much more impactful on the lives of minorities. You know, like the Han Chinese vs muslim minorities in the interior. I mean, I’m sure Muslims can be racist too. And, heck, that’s a real issue in the middle east. Slavery is sorta not cool.

You know, context and taking into account broader power dynamics is kinda really important.

And, you know, saying that calling the Trump presidency racist is « racializing everything » is nuts. Dude’s been overtly racist in a sickening way. And it matters cause he’s the president and he’s whipping up racism in the majority against minorities who are already victims of unfair power dynamics and discrimination.

I don’t get it. You claim that french Canadians are victims of centuries of discrimination, that the discrimination still exists and the way to protect themselves is to become a separate country......but you don’t really see how blacks, muslims, hispanics in the US are discriminated against...or think that it makes sense to water down their legitimate grievances by yelling “both sides” all the time. Why won’t anybody stand up for the white mens in murica or the han chinese in China or the sunni in saudi arabia and call out the bullshit of their minorities..

Dude, wtf?
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11415 by Slick Nick » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:09 pm

Dog wrote:Are members of minorities racist? Absolutely, nobody would deny that. If there is more focus on racist acts from the majority, it’s first and foremost because their dominant position makes it much more impactful on the lives of minorities. You know, like the Han Chinese vs muslim minorities in the interior. I mean, I’m sure Muslims can be racist. And, heck, that’s a real issue in the middle east. Slavery is sorta not cool.

You know, context and taking into account broader power dynamics is kinda really important.

And, you know, saying that calling the Trump presidency racist is « racializing everything » is nuts. Dude’s been overtly racist in a sickening way. And it matters cause he’s the president and he’s whipping up racism in the majority against minorities who are already victims of unfair power dynamics and discrimination.

I don’t get it. You claim that french Canadians are victims of centuries of discrimination, that the discrimination still exists and the way to protect themselves is to become a separate country......but you don’t really see how blacks, muslims, hispanics in the US are discriminated against...or think that it makes sense to water down their legitimate grievances by yelling “both sides” all the time. Why won’t anybody stand up for the white mens in murica or the han chinese in China or the sunni in saudi arabia and call out the bullshit of their minorities..

Dude, wtf?


Maybe you should read my posts instead of trying to words in my mouth, dog. When did I ever say that there's no racism against minorities? The only thing I've be saying for months now is that we will never win this battle if we keep making race the center of every discussion. If we don't treat each other as people before people of race and color, we'll always be stuck in that stupid loop. And when I'm talking about racializing everything, I'm talking about cultural appropriation nonsense, evaluating movies not on their content but rather on how many people of color there were in the cast, blaming voting patterns on skin color, etc.

Dog wrote:Are members of minorities racist? Absolutely, nobody would deny that.


From the modern sociological approach, only white people can be racist because racism is prejudice + social power. That's like a dogma on the left nowadays, dog.

Why won’t anybody stand up for the white mens in murica or the han chinese in China or the sunni in saudi arabia and call out the bullshit of their minorities..


It's not about standing up for the white man, it's standing up for a principle.. we either don't accept any racism, or we accept all of it... accepting racism for some groups of people is an utterly aberrant idea in a society that pretends to want to eradicate it.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11416 by Slick Nick » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:22 pm

Dr_Chimera wrote: How thin-skinned must one be to take offense?


Yeah, I guess I'm thin-skinned because I find it wrong for a public persona to call for the extinction of a whole race.. but those people protesting outside a sushi joint because the owner is of Norwegian decent are the real heroes of modern times, right?
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11417 by senate » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:40 pm

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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11418 by Dr_Chimera » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:43 pm

Edit: After reading another one of dog's long masterpieces I have decided to stay out of this.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11419 by Dog » Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:13 pm

I don’t know, man. We were talking about Trump (the prez of the USA) being racist and race baiting and you come in here making the very valid counterpoint of some random minority on twitter.

Is all racism bad? absolutely. Does that mean that when the prez of the USA makes obcene racist and race baiting comments we shouldn’t call it because, you know, minorities make racist comments on twitter too?

The preponderance of power is important. You can’t just pretend that the acts of the potus and parts of his administration = shit random people say. What that is, Nick, whether you realize it or not is excusing and watering down very dangerous overt acts of racism by powerful people and majorities, diminishing very real institutional racism against minorities by making FALSE EQUIVALENCIES with much less impactful and potent acts. You can’t take the power dynamics out of the equation. And it’s not about whites. The aggressive, nationalist and often race inspired acts of Han Chinese, Indians, Saudis, Poles, Russians are all very problematic for their minorities. And their impactful shit shouldn’t be burried or silenced under « both sides » false equivalencies.

If, separately, you want to talk about sjw that goes overboard, that’s fine. I’ll agree with some and disagree with others. That thing about canceling Slav and whatnot was retarded to me. I think Norwegians should be able to run sushi AND curry joints if they damn well feel like it. Different things deserve to be analyzed and discussed on their own merits.

Trying to silence or water down very legitimate criticisms of dangerous racial baiting and scapegoating of minorities by governments and majorities because some random sjw said this or that is gross. Seriously, I think you are in good faith. I think you are a smart guy. Can’t you see what you’re doing? Don’t call nazis out because, hey, this jewish guy is racist or oversensitive. Both sides! Hundreds of thousands of muslim Chinese are being forced into internment camps....hey both sides! The POTUS is the guy that started the birther movement, called south american migrants rapists and murderers, started his admin with a race baiting ban of travellers from muslim countries, has a large following amongst white supremacists he frequently caters to...hey random girl on twitter and sjw!

Come on!
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11420 by Dog » Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:27 pm

If you get a Canadian PM that is overtly racist towards les Québécois and, when called on it, you have people interjecting....well now, let’s stop racializing everything, all racism is bad and some frenchies are also racist or go overboard...so like don’t single out the Canadian PM or the angry anglos walking with torches for an english Quebec and Canada... what would you call that? A fair and balanced outlook?
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11421 by PredsFan77 » Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:32 pm

Y’all just need to steal a plane
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11422 by Dog » Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:34 pm

I’m not bothered by it.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11423 by Dr_Chimera » Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:30 pm

Is Battlestar Galactica any good? I don't mind the genre of white people being miserable as much as Sarah Jeong.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11424 by jester » Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:54 pm

Slick Nick wrote:I'm of the opinion that the left's propensity to racialise every aspect of life is only making things worse in the long run. And garbage like this should offend you as much as any racist garbage you hear from the fart-right, but somehow it doesn't and you even seem to caution this attitude.


Points for the false equivalence between an Asian woman popping off on twitter with a bunch of young, white men ... let alone the POTUS spouting racist garbage. Racism is partially language and rhetoric, but it is also very much about power. The far right's rhetoric and actions operate within an environment of privilege, and the hysterics derive from the perceived loss of that privilege. That is *very* different than a minority holding up a mirror and calling out the BS that goes on.

A black man that commits the same crime as a white man in this country is significantly more likely to be executed for that crime. Race is one of the defining features of American political and cultural life. There is no escaping it. It has been a dominant feature of literally every moment of our collective history. Our political, legal, and economic history is inextricably intertwined with racial discrimination. We simply cannot wave a magic wand and say none of that matters. That the historical weight of systemic racism has no effect on the moment. Particularly when one of the major political parties has allowed itself to be the home of racists for decades, and is now empowering them. So, no, I'm going to remain much more offended by the far right's racist garbage. Their racist garbage has justified lynchings, red lining, etc. and POC have every reason to be angry about it.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11425 by senate » Sun Aug 12, 2018 12:10 am

Dr_Chimera wrote:Is Battlestar Galactica any good? I don't mind the genre of white people being miserable as much as Sarah Jeong.


The first two seasons are good (with a few clunker episodes); the third season is mediocre; and the last season is bad.

The show-runner was Ronald Moore, who was a writer-producer on DS9, and just like DS9, the show really falls apart whenever it does religion/prophesy/destiny shit. Season 4 is all religion shit.

Also, I don't think the people that Sarah Jeong was trying to troll would consider Edward James Osmos white, but maybe that was part of the troll?
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11426 by Dr_Chimera » Sun Aug 12, 2018 1:11 pm

Next time some idiot says "fuck yeah America look at our GDP dude, excellent".

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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11427 by jester » Sun Aug 12, 2018 1:19 pm

It's a big problem, with a lot of personal biases at play. For example, my mother in law who thinks it's remarkable to suggest that average Americans do not benefit much from the stock market going up. She thinks that way entirely because they have non-trivial investments, and she doesn't perceive herself as abnormal.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11428 by Dog » Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:39 pm

jester wrote:It's a big problem, with a lot of personal biases at play. For example, my mother in law who thinks it's remarkable to suggest that average Americans do not benefit much from the stock market going up. She thinks that way entirely because they have non-trivial investments, and she doesn't perceive herself as abnormal.


The impact of the cuts, on an already heated economy, was always predicted by almost any serious economist to lead to inflation, accelerated rate hikes and ballooning deficits. It’s a disastrous short term cash grab by corporate america.

US inflation is already at 3% (highest sonce 2012, with core inflation (ex oil and food) at highest since 2008). That’s the reason why wage growth has been flat and is now going negative in real terms. I don’t think most people realize it yet because of ´money illussion’ (ie. people think in nominal, not real money terms). But as inflation persists and continues to rise, the effects of negative real growth in wages will become very perceptive. Workers will be further stretched and demand will fall...in a context of rising rates.

The tax cuts are a myopic short term cash grab. I’m just hoping for continued acceleration of inflation growth, so that this short term unsustainable boom can blow up and consequences be felt and known prior to 2020. Of course, if the Dems take the House, GOP will just blame that (ie. things where great until Dems gained the power to obstruct in congress).
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11429 by Dog » Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:50 pm

I’m actually in amazement at the seemingly endless level of greed and shortsightedness of US right wing corporate/billionaire interests. Wealth was already hyper concentrated and the economy was already going at near capacity. So what do you do? Throw a fucking grenade at it that’s sure to lead to high inflation, accelerated capital concentration and drops in real wages. Way.Too.Much.Greed.

I think for some it’s purely ideological. Well, ideology blinded by greed, self interest and quasi-sociopathic social instincts.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11430 by Dog » Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:52 pm

The Doctor is going to scold me again for my long posts.

Twitter banalities >> stream of consciousness long posts.

:why:
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11431 by senate » Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:32 pm

Dog wrote:The Doctor is going to scold me again for my long posts.

Twitter banalities >> stream of consciousness long posts.

:why:


Just put random gifs and images in-between paragraphs. People here seem to like that.

Dog wrote:The impact of the cuts, on an already heated economy, was always predicted by almost any serious economist to lead to inflation, accelerated rate hikes and ballooning deficits. It’s a disastrous short term cash grab by corporate america.



US inflation is already at 3% (highest sonce 2012, with core inflation (ex oil and food) at highest since 2008). That’s the reason why wage growth has been flat and is now going negative in real terms. I don’t think most people realize it yet because of ´money illussion’ (ie. people think in nominal, not real money terms). But as inflation persists and continues to rise, the effects of negative real growth in wages will become very perceptive. Workers will be further stretched and demand will fall...in a context of rising rates.




The tax cuts are a myopic short term cash grab. I’m just hoping for continued acceleration of inflation growth, so that this short term unsustainable boom can blow up and consequences be felt and known prior to 2020. Of course, if the Dems take the House, GOP will just blame that (ie. things where great until Dems gained the power to obstruct in congress).

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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11432 by Dog » Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:44 pm

Was that an otter? Can’t see it very well. How big is an otter supposed to be?
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11433 by Dog » Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:46 pm

Not that size matters. He shouldn’t be crying like that.

:rimshot:
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11434 by senate » Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:50 pm

Dog wrote:Was that an otter? Can’t see it very well. How big is an otter supposed to be?


I believe that's a weasel.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11435 by shredz » Sun Aug 12, 2018 5:22 pm

Treason Weasel.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11436 by Dr_Chimera » Sun Aug 12, 2018 5:25 pm

Dog wrote:The Doctor is going to scold me again for my long posts.

Twitter banalities >> stream of consciousness long posts.

:why:


All right settle down, Marcel Proust.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11437 by shredz » Sun Aug 12, 2018 5:42 pm

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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11438 by Dog » Sun Aug 12, 2018 5:49 pm

Dr_Chimera wrote:
Dog wrote:The Doctor is going to scold me again for my long posts.

Twitter banalities >> stream of consciousness long posts.

:why:


All right settle down, Marcel Proust.


Image

:bouillon:
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11439 by shredz » Sun Aug 12, 2018 5:59 pm

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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11440 by senate » Sun Aug 12, 2018 6:15 pm

For a long time I used to go to bed early. Sometimes, when I had put out my candle, my eyes would close so quickly that I had not even time to say "The impact of the cuts, on an already heated economy, was always predicted by almost any serious economist to lead to inflation, accelerated rate hikes and ballooning deficits. It’s a disastrous short term cash grab by corporate america. US inflation is already at 3% (highest sonce 2012, with core inflation (ex oil and food) at highest since 2008). That’s the reason why wage growth has been flat and is now going negative in real terms. I don’t think most people realize it yet because of ´money illussion’ (ie. people think in nominal, not real money terms). But as inflation persists and continues to rise, the effects of negative real growth in wages will become very perceptive. Workers will be further stretched and demand will fall...in a context of rising rates. The tax cuts are a myopic short term cash grab. I’m just hoping for continued acceleration of inflation growth, so that this short term unsustainable boom can blow up and consequences be felt and known prior to 2020. Of course, if the Dems take the House, GOP will just blame that (ie. things where great until Dems gained the power to obstruct in congress)." And half an hour later the thought that it was time to go to sleep would awaken me; I would try to put away the book which, I imagined, was still in my hands, and to blow out the light; I had been thinking all the time, while I was asleep, of what I had just been reading, but my thoughts had run into a channel of their own, until I myself seemed actually to have become the subject of my book: a church, a quartet, the rivalry between François I and Charles V. This impression would persist for some moments after I was awake; it did not disturb my mind, but it lay like scales upon my eyes and prevented them from registering the fact that the candle was no longer burning. Then it would begin to seem unintelligible, as the thoughts of a former existence must be to a reincarnate spirit; the subject of my book would separate itself from me, leaving me free to choose whether I would form part of it or no; and at the same time my sight would return and I would be astonished to find myself in a state of darkness, pleasant and restful enough for the eyes, and even more, perhaps, for my mind, to which it appeared incomprehensible, without a cause, a matter dark indeed.

I would ask myself what o'clock it could be; I could hear the whistling of trains, which, now nearer and now farther off, punctuating the distance like the note of a bird in a forest, shewed me in perspective the deserted countryside through which a traveller would be hurrying towards the nearest station: the path that he followed being fixed for ever in his memory by the general excitement due to being in a strange place, to doing unusual things, to the last words of conversation, to farewells exchanged beneath an unfamiliar lamp which echoed still in his ears amid the silence of the night; and to the delightful prospect of being once again at home.

I would lay my cheeks gently against the comfortable cheeks of my pillow, as plump and blooming as the cheeks of babyhood. Or I would strike a match to look at my watch. Nearly midnight. The hour when an invalid, who has been obliged to start on a journey and to sleep in a strange hotel, awakens in a moment of illness and sees with glad relief a streak of daylight shewing under his bedroom door. Oh, joy of joys! it is morning. The servants will be about in a minute: he can ring, and some one will come to look after him. The thought of being made comfortable gives him strength to endure his pain. He is certain he heard footsteps: they come nearer, and then die away. The ray of light beneath his door is extinguished. It is midnight; some one has turned out the gas; the last servant has gone to bed, and he must lie all night in agony with no one to bring him any help.

I would fall asleep, and often I would be awake again for short snatches only, just long enough to hear the regular creaking of the wainscot, or to open my eyes to settle the shifting kaleidoscope of the darkness, to savour, in an instantaneous flash of perception, the sleep which lay heavy upon the furniture, the room, the whole surroundings of which I formed but an insignificant part and whose unconsciousness I should very soon return to share. Or, perhaps, while I was asleep I had returned without the least effort to an earlier stage in my life, now for ever outgrown; and had come under the thrall of one of my childish terrors, such as that old terror of my great-uncle's pulling my curls, which was effectually dispelled on the day—the dawn of a new era to me—on which they were finally cropped from my head. I had forgotten that event during my sleep; I remembered it again immediately I had succeeded in making myself wake up to escape my great-uncle's fingers; still, as a measure of precaution, I would bury the whole of my head in the pillow before returning to the world of dreams.

Sometimes, too, just as Eve was created from a rib of Adam, so a woman would come into existence while I was sleeping, conceived from some strain in the position of my limbs. Formed by the appetite that I was on the point of gratifying, she it was, I imagined, who offered me that gratification. My body, conscious that its own warmth was permeating hers, would strive to become one with her, and I would awake. The rest of humanity seemed very remote in comparison with this woman whose company I had left but a moment ago: my cheek was still warm with her kiss, my body bent beneath the weight of hers. If, as would sometimes happen, she had the appearance of some woman whom I had known in waking hours, I would abandon myself altogether to the sole quest of her, like people who set out on a journey to see with their own eyes some city that they have always longed to visit, and imagine that they can taste in reality what has charmed their fancy. And then, gradually, the memory of her would dissolve and vanish, until I had forgotten the maiden of my dream.

When a man is asleep, he has in a circle round him the chain of the hours, the sequence of the years, the order of the heavenly host. Instinctively, when he awakes, he looks to these, and in an instant reads off his own position on the earth's surface and the amount of time that has elapsed during his slumbers; but this ordered procession is apt to grow confused, and to break its ranks. Suppose that, towards morning, after a night of insomnia, sleep descends upon him while he is reading, in quite a different position from that in which he normally goes to sleep, he has only to lift his arm to arrest the sun and turn it back in its course, and, at the moment of waking, he will have no idea of the time, but will conclude that he has just gone to bed. Or suppose that he gets drowsy in some even more abnormal position; sitting in an armchair, say, after dinner: then the world will fall topsy-turvy from its orbit, the magic chair will carry him at full speed through time and space, and when he opens his eyes again he will imagine that he went to sleep months earlier and in some far distant country. But for me it was enough if, in my own bed, my sleep was so heavy as completely to relax my consciousness; for then I lost all sense of the place in which I had gone to sleep, and when I awoke at midnight, not knowing where I was, I could not be sure at first who I was; I had only the most rudimentary sense of existence, such as may lurk and flicker in the depths of an animal's consciousness; I was more destitute of human qualities than the cave-dweller; but then the memory, not yet of the place in which I was, but of various other places where I had lived, and might now very possibly be, would come like a rope let down from heaven to draw me up out of the abyss of not-being, from which I could never have escaped by myself: in a flash I would traverse and surmount centuries of civilisation, and out of a half-visualised succession of oil-lamps, followed by shirts with turned-down collars, would put together by degrees the component parts of my ego.

Perhaps the immobility of the things that surround us is forced upon them by our conviction that they are themselves, and not anything else, and by the immobility of our conceptions of them. For it always happened that when I awoke like this, and my mind struggled in an unsuccessful attempt to discover where I was, everything would be moving round me through the darkness: things, places, years. My body, still too heavy with sleep to move, would make an effort to construe the form which its tiredness took as an orientation of its various members, so as to induce from that where the wall lay and the furniture stood, to piece together and to give a name to the house in which it must be living. Its memory, the composite memory of its ribs, knees, and shoulder-blades offered it a whole series of rooms in which it had at one time or another slept; while the unseen walls kept changing, adapting themselves to the shape of each successive room that it remembered, whirling madly through the darkness. And even before my brain, lingering in consideration of when things had happened and of what they had looked like, had collected sufficient impressions to enable it to identify the room, it, my body, would recall from each room in succession what the bed was like, where the doors were, how daylight came in at the windows, whether there was a passage outside, what I had had in my mind when I went to sleep, and had found there when I awoke. The stiffened side underneath my body would, for instance, in trying to fix its position, imagine itself to be lying, face to the wall, in a big bed with a canopy; and at once I would say to myself, "Why, I must have gone to sleep after all, and Mamma never came to say good night!" for I was in the country with my grandfather, who died years ago; and my body, the side upon which I was lying, loyally preserving from the past an impression which my mind should never have forgotten, brought back before my eyes the glimmering flame of the night-light in its bowl of Bohemian glass, shaped like an urn and hung by chains from the ceiling, and the chimney-piece of Siena marble in my bedroom at Combray, in my great-aunt's house, in those far distant days which, at the moment of waking, seemed present without being clearly penned, but would become plainer in a little while when I was properly awake.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11441 by PredsFan77 » Sun Aug 12, 2018 6:56 pm

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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11442 by Dog » Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:22 pm

senate wrote:For a long time I used to go to bed early. Sometimes, when I had put out my candle, my eyes would close so quickly that I had not even time to say "The impact of the cuts, on an already heated economy, was always predicted by almost any serious economist to lead to inflation, accelerated rate hikes and ballooning deficits. It’s a disastrous short term cash grab by corporate america. US inflation is already at 3% (highest sonce 2012, with core inflation (ex oil and food) at highest since 2008). That’s the reason why wage growth has been flat and is now going negative in real terms. I don’t think most people realize it yet because of ´money illussion’ (ie. people think in nominal, not real money terms). But as inflation persists and continues to rise, the effects of negative real growth in wages will become very perceptive. Workers will be further stretched and demand will fall...in a context of rising rates. The tax cuts are a myopic short term cash grab. I’m just hoping for continued acceleration of inflation growth, so that this short term unsustainable boom can blow up and consequences be felt and known prior to 2020. Of course, if the Dems take the House, GOP will just blame that (ie. things where great until Dems gained the power to obstruct in congress)." And half an hour later the thought that it was time to go to sleep would awaken me; I would try to put away the book which, I imagined, was still in my hands, and to blow out the light; I had been thinking all the time, while I was asleep, of what I had just been reading, but my thoughts had run into a channel of their own, until I myself seemed actually to have become the subject of my book: a church, a quartet, the rivalry between François I and Charles V. This impression would persist for some moments after I was awake; it did not disturb my mind, but it lay like scales upon my eyes and prevented them from registering the fact that the candle was no longer burning. Then it would begin to seem unintelligible, as the thoughts of a former existence must be to a reincarnate spirit; the subject of my book would separate itself from me, leaving me free to choose whether I would form part of it or no; and at the same time my sight would return and I would be astonished to find myself in a state of darkness, pleasant and restful enough for the eyes, and even more, perhaps, for my mind, to which it appeared incomprehensible, without a cause, a matter dark indeed.

I would ask myself what o'clock it could be; I could hear the whistling of trains, which, now nearer and now farther off, punctuating the distance like the note of a bird in a forest, shewed me in perspective the deserted countryside through which a traveller would be hurrying towards the nearest station: the path that he followed being fixed for ever in his memory by the general excitement due to being in a strange place, to doing unusual things, to the last words of conversation, to farewells exchanged beneath an unfamiliar lamp which echoed still in his ears amid the silence of the night; and to the delightful prospect of being once again at home.

I would lay my cheeks gently against the comfortable cheeks of my pillow, as plump and blooming as the cheeks of babyhood. Or I would strike a match to look at my watch. Nearly midnight. The hour when an invalid, who has been obliged to start on a journey and to sleep in a strange hotel, awakens in a moment of illness and sees with glad relief a streak of daylight shewing under his bedroom door. Oh, joy of joys! it is morning. The servants will be about in a minute: he can ring, and some one will come to look after him. The thought of being made comfortable gives him strength to endure his pain. He is certain he heard footsteps: they come nearer, and then die away. The ray of light beneath his door is extinguished. It is midnight; some one has turned out the gas; the last servant has gone to bed, and he must lie all night in agony with no one to bring him any help.

I would fall asleep, and often I would be awake again for short snatches only, just long enough to hear the regular creaking of the wainscot, or to open my eyes to settle the shifting kaleidoscope of the darkness, to savour, in an instantaneous flash of perception, the sleep which lay heavy upon the furniture, the room, the whole surroundings of which I formed but an insignificant part and whose unconsciousness I should very soon return to share. Or, perhaps, while I was asleep I had returned without the least effort to an earlier stage in my life, now for ever outgrown; and had come under the thrall of one of my childish terrors, such as that old terror of my great-uncle's pulling my curls, which was effectually dispelled on the day—the dawn of a new era to me—on which they were finally cropped from my head. I had forgotten that event during my sleep; I remembered it again immediately I had succeeded in making myself wake up to escape my great-uncle's fingers; still, as a measure of precaution, I would bury the whole of my head in the pillow before returning to the world of dreams.

Sometimes, too, just as Eve was created from a rib of Adam, so a woman would come into existence while I was sleeping, conceived from some strain in the position of my limbs. Formed by the appetite that I was on the point of gratifying, she it was, I imagined, who offered me that gratification. My body, conscious that its own warmth was permeating hers, would strive to become one with her, and I would awake. The rest of humanity seemed very remote in comparison with this woman whose company I had left but a moment ago: my cheek was still warm with her kiss, my body bent beneath the weight of hers. If, as would sometimes happen, she had the appearance of some woman whom I had known in waking hours, I would abandon myself altogether to the sole quest of her, like people who set out on a journey to see with their own eyes some city that they have always longed to visit, and imagine that they can taste in reality what has charmed their fancy. And then, gradually, the memory of her would dissolve and vanish, until I had forgotten the maiden of my dream.

When a man is asleep, he has in a circle round him the chain of the hours, the sequence of the years, the order of the heavenly host. Instinctively, when he awakes, he looks to these, and in an instant reads off his own position on the earth's surface and the amount of time that has elapsed during his slumbers; but this ordered procession is apt to grow confused, and to break its ranks. Suppose that, towards morning, after a night of insomnia, sleep descends upon him while he is reading, in quite a different position from that in which he normally goes to sleep, he has only to lift his arm to arrest the sun and turn it back in its course, and, at the moment of waking, he will have no idea of the time, but will conclude that he has just gone to bed. Or suppose that he gets drowsy in some even more abnormal position; sitting in an armchair, say, after dinner: then the world will fall topsy-turvy from its orbit, the magic chair will carry him at full speed through time and space, and when he opens his eyes again he will imagine that he went to sleep months earlier and in some far distant country. But for me it was enough if, in my own bed, my sleep was so heavy as completely to relax my consciousness; for then I lost all sense of the place in which I had gone to sleep, and when I awoke at midnight, not knowing where I was, I could not be sure at first who I was; I had only the most rudimentary sense of existence, such as may lurk and flicker in the depths of an animal's consciousness; I was more destitute of human qualities than the cave-dweller; but then the memory, not yet of the place in which I was, but of various other places where I had lived, and might now very possibly be, would come like a rope let down from heaven to draw me up out of the abyss of not-being, from which I could never have escaped by myself: in a flash I would traverse and surmount centuries of civilisation, and out of a half-visualised succession of oil-lamps, followed by shirts with turned-down collars, would put together by degrees the component parts of my ego.

Perhaps the immobility of the things that surround us is forced upon them by our conviction that they are themselves, and not anything else, and by the immobility of our conceptions of them. For it always happened that when I awoke like this, and my mind struggled in an unsuccessful attempt to discover where I was, everything would be moving round me through the darkness: things, places, years. My body, still too heavy with sleep to move, would make an effort to construe the form which its tiredness took as an orientation of its various members, so as to induce from that where the wall lay and the furniture stood, to piece together and to give a name to the house in which it must be living. Its memory, the composite memory of its ribs, knees, and shoulder-blades offered it a whole series of rooms in which it had at one time or another slept; while the unseen walls kept changing, adapting themselves to the shape of each successive room that it remembered, whirling madly through the darkness. And even before my brain, lingering in consideration of when things had happened and of what they had looked like, had collected sufficient impressions to enable it to identify the room, it, my body, would recall from each room in succession what the bed was like, where the doors were, how daylight came in at the windows, whether there was a passage outside, what I had had in my mind when I went to sleep, and had found there when I awoke. The stiffened side underneath my body would, for instance, in trying to fix its position, imagine itself to be lying, face to the wall, in a big bed with a canopy; and at once I would say to myself, "Why, I must have gone to sleep after all, and Mamma never came to say good night!" for I was in the country with my grandfather, who died years ago; and my body, the side upon which I was lying, loyally preserving from the past an impression which my mind should never have forgotten, brought back before my eyes the glimmering flame of the night-light in its bowl of Bohemian glass, shaped like an urn and hung by chains from the ceiling, and the chimney-piece of Siena marble in my bedroom at Combray, in my great-aunt's house, in those far distant days which, at the moment of waking, seemed present without being clearly penned, but would become plainer in a little while when I was properly awake.


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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11443 by Dog » Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:32 pm

Did I do it right?
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11444 by Dog » Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:48 pm

20? Slick was right.

:why:

Unite the Right: White nationalists outnumbered at Washington rally http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-45165656
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11445 by Slick Nick » Sun Aug 12, 2018 10:40 pm

Dog wrote:I don’t know, man. We were talking about Trump (the prez of the USA) being racist and race baiting and you come in here making the very valid counterpoint of some random minority on twitter.

Is all racism bad? absolutely. Does that mean that when the prez of the USA makes obcene racist and race baiting comments we shouldn’t call it because, you know, minorities make racist comments on twitter too?

The preponderance of power is important. You can’t just pretend that the acts of the potus and parts of his administration = shit random people say. What that is, Nick, whether you realize it or not is excusing and watering down very dangerous overt acts of racism by powerful people and majorities, diminishing very real institutional racism against minorities by making FALSE EQUIVALENCIES with much less impactful and potent acts. You can’t take the power dynamics out of the equation. And it’s not about whites. The aggressive, nationalist and often race inspired acts of Han Chinese, Indians, Saudis, Poles, Russians are all very problematic for their minorities. And their impactful shit shouldn’t be burried or silenced under « both sides » false equivalencies.

If, separately, you want to talk about sjw that goes overboard, that’s fine. I’ll agree with some and disagree with others. That thing about canceling Slav and whatnot was retarded to me. I think Norwegians should be able to run sushi AND curry joints if they damn well feel like it. Different things deserve to be analyzed and discussed on their own merits.

Trying to silence or water down very legitimate criticisms of dangerous racial baiting and scapegoating of minorities by governments and majorities because some random sjw said this or that is gross. Seriously, I think you are in good faith. I think you are a smart guy. Can’t you see what you’re doing? Don’t call nazis out because, hey, this jewish guy is racist or oversensitive. Both sides! Hundreds of thousands of muslim Chinese are being forced into internment camps....hey both sides! The POTUS is the guy that started the birther movement, called south american migrants rapists and murderers, started his admin with a race baiting ban of travellers from muslim countries, has a large following amongst white supremacists he frequently caters to...hey random girl on twitter and sjw!

Come on!


I would answer something in the lines of I've never meant to makes equivalencies between real, systemic racism, and that cunty wong's tweets and that I was only trying to demonstrate how people on a certain left tend to think anyone who doesn't vote democrat is a racist while themselves being part of the problem by promoting garbage that in the end only helps to push people to the fringes... but I spent last night drinkin arak from the bottle in a pool and I can't make any significant intellectual effort right now.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11446 by Dr_Chimera » Sun Aug 12, 2018 10:49 pm

Slick Nick wrote:I would answer something in the lines of I've never meant to makes equivalencies between real, systemic racism, and that cunty wong's tweets and that I was only trying to demonstrate how people on a certain left tend to think anyone who doesn't vote democrat is a racist while themselves being part of the problem by promoting garbage that in the end only helps to push people to the fringes... but I spent last night drinkin arak from the bottle in a pool and I can't make any significant intellectual effort right now.


I recall you saying this, Nick:

garbage like this should offend you as much as any racist garbage you hear from the fart-right


You definitely "horseshoe theoried" this one.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11447 by Slick Nick » Sun Aug 12, 2018 10:55 pm

How is "garbage from the fart-right" equivalent to systemic racism... we're talking about a bunch of incels on 4chan.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11448 by Dr_Chimera » Sun Aug 12, 2018 10:58 pm

Slick Nick wrote:How is "garbage from the fart-right" equivalent to systemic racism... we're talking about a bunch of incels on 4chan.


Incels who celebrate systemic racism.
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11449 by Dog » Sun Aug 12, 2018 11:31 pm

I was talking about the potus. Litterally, we were talking about « would americans learn anything new if a tape surfaced with Trump making racial slurs ». Then Jester replied that some people seem to really need to have it spelled out for them before they recognize racism. Then Slick posted some off-the-wall stuff from an asian chick. Then we were all like wtf are you talking about? Then he was like, SJWs suck! Then we were like, wtf are you talking about!

You guys were talking about incels?

:why:
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Re: Murrica: fuck yeah

Post #11450 by Slick Nick » Sun Aug 12, 2018 11:42 pm

Dog wrote:I was talking about the potus. Litterally, we were talking about « would americans learn anything new if a tape surfaced with Trump making racial slurs ». Then Jester replied that some people seem to really need to have it spelled out for them before they recognize racism. Then Slick posted some off-the-wall stuff from an asian chick. Then we were all like wtf are you talking about? Then he was like, SJWs suck! Then we were like, wtf are you talking about!

You guys were talking about incels?

:why:


to be honest a barely read those posts and really just focused on this sentence:

have a narrow understanding of racism. It needs to be really explicit before they'll grasp it.


which I quoted.

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